Sign In »
Register Now!
Help
Fire Bomblet is a ton better than Bomb Core for meleeing. 6 attack will have very little noticable effect, 6 accuracy will have a noticable effect, especially when you choose big attack pieces for other slots and haste over all else for other equipment.
Thief Endgame Gear Guide - Please read before making gear posts!
Back to top
#22
Posted 13 February 2007 - 12:10 PM
Man, fuck this piece of shit website. I just wrote up a 30 minute post and it got eaten.
Thanks for the love torque DEX correction, I missed that.
People don't value STR highly for a reason for meleeing - beyond mantle and ring, many thieves don't have any at all. If you want to argue for Cerb+1 > Chargers, or Rajas Ring over Divisor, ok - beyond that I'm not sure what you can come up with, and that's only +9 total.
Histatius, I feel that the +8 racc on Ziska's will result in enough additional landed acid bolts that it will more than make up for the +14 delay when pulling. Also note that the dagger comparisons you are upset about are for off-hand, where base DMG is much less important and DPS/useful buffs to mainhand and party are much more important. Since X's Knife crit dmg+ only affects itself, I feel it drops off alot. Since you only offhand P. Harpe when mainhanding a relic, I feel it's high delay is a liability vs. some other daggers, since it results in less Relic swinging. If you wish to create your own dagger order to post as a counterpoint (one for mainhand, one for offhand) I'd like to take a look at it though.
Ammo slot is the most efficient place to add accuracy, and if you're in the best merit point camps in the game (G. Colibris, Ulegerand Range) you're fighting as many IT mobs as anything else, and will appreciate the 50+ accuracy.
Thanks for the love torque DEX correction, I missed that.
People don't value STR highly for a reason for meleeing - beyond mantle and ring, many thieves don't have any at all. If you want to argue for Cerb+1 > Chargers, or Rajas Ring over Divisor, ok - beyond that I'm not sure what you can come up with, and that's only +9 total.
Histatius, I feel that the +8 racc on Ziska's will result in enough additional landed acid bolts that it will more than make up for the +14 delay when pulling. Also note that the dagger comparisons you are upset about are for off-hand, where base DMG is much less important and DPS/useful buffs to mainhand and party are much more important. Since X's Knife crit dmg+ only affects itself, I feel it drops off alot. Since you only offhand P. Harpe when mainhanding a relic, I feel it's high delay is a liability vs. some other daggers, since it results in less Relic swinging. If you wish to create your own dagger order to post as a counterpoint (one for mainhand, one for offhand) I'd like to take a look at it though.
Ammo slot is the most efficient place to add accuracy, and if you're in the best merit point camps in the game (G. Colibris, Ulegerand Range) you're fighting as many IT mobs as anything else, and will appreciate the 50+ accuracy.
#23
Posted 13 February 2007 - 12:41 PM
That's happened to me before 
You see the "Page not foudn" error and are praying the back button will still have your data, but to no avail
Personally i'd probably argue for Forager > Charger
But Ring is hard to classify, since you get two of them. I would definitely say that if you only had one ring slot, Divisor > Toreador > Sniper+1 > Rajas > Sniper, but with two ring slots I would wear a Rajas in one slot no matter what else I had available.
You see the "Page not foudn" error and are praying the back button will still have your data, but to no avail
Personally i'd probably argue for Forager > Charger
But Ring is hard to classify, since you get two of them. I would definitely say that if you only had one ring slot, Divisor > Toreador > Sniper+1 > Rajas > Sniper, but with two ring slots I would wear a Rajas in one slot no matter what else I had available.
#24
Guest_Mirax_*
Posted 13 February 2007 - 01:36 PM
Okay few things to consider.
"Offhand /nin: Batardeau/Blau Dolch/Sirocco Kukri/Stylet/Adder Jambiya+1"
I would like to take a shot at this. The point of a thfs offhand is to support his mainhand, not be a seperate entity. Since Offhand Base Dmg only matters for normal hits and not ws's, the base dmg of the dagger is not important. The low delay however is. Lets look at barardeau, If I remember when I had it it was 200 delay,. So essentially you are working with a 376 delay before reduction, and no benifit to your offhand. Now consider blau, you gain 16 att 5-6 acc, and a delay of 173, meaning that your total delay will be 349 before reduction. 27 delay points faster, 16 attack, and 5-6 acc over base dmg which doesnt make a bit of diff at this point since its offhand. Batardeau should come at the end of the above list, given points for e-peen. Adder Jam and +1 should be moved to 1rst/2nd position. Sure the thf sacrifices a little dps, but gives essentially every mob a feint effect, boosting greatly the acc of 2-3 other melees in the pt. This is incredably helpful to merit parties, and on things like KV, melee kirin, and a BahaV2 zerg. Mine would go, assuming mandau mainhand.
Adder +1 / NQ (if needed for feint only, otherwise blau first) / Blau / Ridill(specially with suppa and 4 merits) / Sirocco / Stylet / Batardeau / P.harpe.
I loved Blau / sirocco pre mandau, im incliend to stick with that.
4 small things,
Ranged: Velocity+1, Dunno where it would go, but decent I think. I use Ziskas.
Body: Homam / Pln / Scorp+1 are used for TP gain whereass skadi / heca / dh would be used for WS. Id wait to include the latter 3 until you get your ws gear set up and in lists. This'll be hard since Heca+1 harness takes the cake for mercy, where as skadi > dh+1 for pretty much anything else. Little hesitant with Dancing, since dex at 30% is hardly something to worry about, and Str is awesome for multihit along with acc, but thats something to be left up to the user I guess. I havent used dancing in like 4 months in exp so no realy chance to test this.
I also Agree foragers > chargers, if nothing else for one less piece you have to switch duing Ratt and WS
Sniper+1 > Toreador imo, 10 hp does nothing since you shouldnt be getting hit, and if you are, its at the point where 10 hp wont matter. 7 racc instead is Yet another switch you dont need to worry about.
Thats all
-Mircat-
"Offhand /nin: Batardeau/Blau Dolch/Sirocco Kukri/Stylet/Adder Jambiya+1"
I would like to take a shot at this. The point of a thfs offhand is to support his mainhand, not be a seperate entity. Since Offhand Base Dmg only matters for normal hits and not ws's, the base dmg of the dagger is not important. The low delay however is. Lets look at barardeau, If I remember when I had it it was 200 delay,. So essentially you are working with a 376 delay before reduction, and no benifit to your offhand. Now consider blau, you gain 16 att 5-6 acc, and a delay of 173, meaning that your total delay will be 349 before reduction. 27 delay points faster, 16 attack, and 5-6 acc over base dmg which doesnt make a bit of diff at this point since its offhand. Batardeau should come at the end of the above list, given points for e-peen. Adder Jam and +1 should be moved to 1rst/2nd position. Sure the thf sacrifices a little dps, but gives essentially every mob a feint effect, boosting greatly the acc of 2-3 other melees in the pt. This is incredably helpful to merit parties, and on things like KV, melee kirin, and a BahaV2 zerg. Mine would go, assuming mandau mainhand.
Adder +1 / NQ (if needed for feint only, otherwise blau first) / Blau / Ridill(specially with suppa and 4 merits) / Sirocco / Stylet / Batardeau / P.harpe.
I loved Blau / sirocco pre mandau, im incliend to stick with that.
4 small things,
Ranged: Velocity+1, Dunno where it would go, but decent I think. I use Ziskas.
Body: Homam / Pln / Scorp+1 are used for TP gain whereass skadi / heca / dh would be used for WS. Id wait to include the latter 3 until you get your ws gear set up and in lists. This'll be hard since Heca+1 harness takes the cake for mercy, where as skadi > dh+1 for pretty much anything else. Little hesitant with Dancing, since dex at 30% is hardly something to worry about, and Str is awesome for multihit along with acc, but thats something to be left up to the user I guess. I havent used dancing in like 4 months in exp so no realy chance to test this.
I also Agree foragers > chargers, if nothing else for one less piece you have to switch duing Ratt and WS
Sniper+1 > Toreador imo, 10 hp does nothing since you shouldnt be getting hit, and if you are, its at the point where 10 hp wont matter. 7 racc instead is Yet another switch you dont need to worry about.
Thats all
-Mircat-
#25
Posted 13 February 2007 - 11:13 PM
[quote]Mirax :
Okay few things to consider.
"Offhand /nin: Batardeau/Blau Dolch/Sirocco Kukri/Stylet/Adder Jambiya+1"
I would like to take a shot at this. The point of a thfs offhand is to support his mainhand, not be a seperate entity. Since Offhand Base Dmg only matters for normal hits and not ws's, the base dmg of the dagger is not important. The low delay however is. Lets look at barardeau, If I remember when I had it it was 200 delay,. So essentially you are working with a 376 delay before reduction, and no benifit to your offhand. Now consider blau, you gain 16 att 5-6 acc, and a delay of 173, meaning that your total delay will be 349 before reduction. 27 delay points faster, 16 attack, and 5-6 acc over base dmg which doesnt make a bit of diff at this point since its offhand. Batardeau should come at the end of the above list, given points for e-peen. Adder Jam and +1 should be moved to 1rst/2nd position. Sure the thf sacrifices a little dps, but gives essentially every mob a feint effect, boosting greatly the acc of 2-3 other melees in the pt. This is incredably helpful to merit parties, and on things like KV, melee kirin, and a BahaV2 zerg. Mine would go, assuming mandau mainhand.
Adder +1 / NQ (if needed for feint only, otherwise blau first) / Blau / Ridill(specially with suppa and 4 merits) / Sirocco / Stylet / Batardeau / P.harpe.
I loved Blau / sirocco pre mandau, im incliend to stick with that.
[/quote]There we go. I've been wary myself of Batardeau over Blau. However my (in your opinion) undervaluing of Adder/+1 is because I have 0 info about it. I don't know how often it procs, how significant the evasion down is (...if it's feint-power, holy shit. I have to assume it isn't) and whether it really procs at all on HNMs. The best I can do at the moment is assume, with 0 evidence, that it procs like Magnet knife - frequently on xp mobs, almost never on HNMs. IMO it would have to be as good as you...say? Hope? I can't tell whether you have personal experience with it...in order to put it above Blau or Sirocco Kukri. You are probably right though, I bet it's more beneficial than Stylet - at least the +1 - 1 less delay, 3 more WDMG, useful add effect. I didn't think about Ridill at all, but placing it where you do, after Blau...is maybe right? I really can't say. I know that THF ridill is a very divisive issue, mainly because it requires Sushi from what I understand. I'm accepting offers as to where it should go - anywhere between "ZOMG 1st 4 sur!" and "way, way after magnet knife" are acceptable.
[quote]Mirax :
4 small things,
Ranged: Velocity+1, Dunno where it would go, but decent I think.
[/quote]Do others think this is more valuable than, say, Staurobow? 2 less agi, but lower delay and lolranged attack.
[quote]Mirax :
Body: Homam / Pln / Scorp+1 are used for TP gain whereass skadi / heca / dh would be used for WS.
[/quote]Skadi smokes Pln and Scorp+1 for meleeing that it's silly to not have on the list. IMO DH(and+1) are also marginally better - that's why I have them listed. Don't get me wrong, Skadi is a godly, sick, body armor for WSing, but don't ignore how epic it is for meleeing as well. If the damn attack rate+ that Homam provides wasn't so valuable, it would be #1.[/quote]
[quote]Mirax :
I also Agree foragers > chargers, if nothing else for one less piece you have to switch duing Ratt and WS
Sniper+1 > Toreador imo, 10 hp does nothing since you shouldnt be getting hit, and if you are, its at the point where 10 hp wont matter. 7 racc instead is Yet another switch you dont need to worry about.
[/quote]If you aren't pulling, like on NMs or in good meritpo parties, you won't need to swap for a racc setup anyway. Beyond that, if you are swapping, you'll be wanting to put on better pieces than foragers and Sniper+1 (the idea here being if we're talking about "the best"...then we shouldn't make lesser gear "better" by arguing that it doesn't have to be swapped to shoot, when...well...it should be)
Okay few things to consider.
"Offhand /nin: Batardeau/Blau Dolch/Sirocco Kukri/Stylet/Adder Jambiya+1"
I would like to take a shot at this. The point of a thfs offhand is to support his mainhand, not be a seperate entity. Since Offhand Base Dmg only matters for normal hits and not ws's, the base dmg of the dagger is not important. The low delay however is. Lets look at barardeau, If I remember when I had it it was 200 delay,. So essentially you are working with a 376 delay before reduction, and no benifit to your offhand. Now consider blau, you gain 16 att 5-6 acc, and a delay of 173, meaning that your total delay will be 349 before reduction. 27 delay points faster, 16 attack, and 5-6 acc over base dmg which doesnt make a bit of diff at this point since its offhand. Batardeau should come at the end of the above list, given points for e-peen. Adder Jam and +1 should be moved to 1rst/2nd position. Sure the thf sacrifices a little dps, but gives essentially every mob a feint effect, boosting greatly the acc of 2-3 other melees in the pt. This is incredably helpful to merit parties, and on things like KV, melee kirin, and a BahaV2 zerg. Mine would go, assuming mandau mainhand.
Adder +1 / NQ (if needed for feint only, otherwise blau first) / Blau / Ridill(specially with suppa and 4 merits) / Sirocco / Stylet / Batardeau / P.harpe.
I loved Blau / sirocco pre mandau, im incliend to stick with that.
[/quote]There we go. I've been wary myself of Batardeau over Blau. However my (in your opinion) undervaluing of Adder/+1 is because I have 0 info about it. I don't know how often it procs, how significant the evasion down is (...if it's feint-power, holy shit. I have to assume it isn't) and whether it really procs at all on HNMs. The best I can do at the moment is assume, with 0 evidence, that it procs like Magnet knife - frequently on xp mobs, almost never on HNMs. IMO it would have to be as good as you...say? Hope? I can't tell whether you have personal experience with it...in order to put it above Blau or Sirocco Kukri. You are probably right though, I bet it's more beneficial than Stylet - at least the +1 - 1 less delay, 3 more WDMG, useful add effect. I didn't think about Ridill at all, but placing it where you do, after Blau...is maybe right? I really can't say. I know that THF ridill is a very divisive issue, mainly because it requires Sushi from what I understand. I'm accepting offers as to where it should go - anywhere between "ZOMG 1st 4 sur!" and "way, way after magnet knife" are acceptable.
[quote]Mirax :
4 small things,
Ranged: Velocity+1, Dunno where it would go, but decent I think.
[/quote]Do others think this is more valuable than, say, Staurobow? 2 less agi, but lower delay and lolranged attack.
[quote]Mirax :
Body: Homam / Pln / Scorp+1 are used for TP gain whereass skadi / heca / dh would be used for WS.
[/quote]Skadi smokes Pln and Scorp+1 for meleeing that it's silly to not have on the list. IMO DH(and+1) are also marginally better - that's why I have them listed. Don't get me wrong, Skadi is a godly, sick, body armor for WSing, but don't ignore how epic it is for meleeing as well. If the damn attack rate+ that Homam provides wasn't so valuable, it would be #1.[/quote]
[quote]Mirax :
I also Agree foragers > chargers, if nothing else for one less piece you have to switch duing Ratt and WS
Sniper+1 > Toreador imo, 10 hp does nothing since you shouldnt be getting hit, and if you are, its at the point where 10 hp wont matter. 7 racc instead is Yet another switch you dont need to worry about.
[/quote]If you aren't pulling, like on NMs or in good meritpo parties, you won't need to swap for a racc setup anyway. Beyond that, if you are swapping, you'll be wanting to put on better pieces than foragers and Sniper+1 (the idea here being if we're talking about "the best"...then we shouldn't make lesser gear "better" by arguing that it doesn't have to be swapped to shoot, when...well...it should be)
#26
Guest_Mirax_*
Posted 13 February 2007 - 11:48 PM
Yeah nvm forgot abotu the 10 acc on skadi, yeah it rox.
About the bow: I think what thfs want to aim for is Quickness and Racc, the lower delay allows for spamming bolts faster, and the loss of 1 racc(2 agi?) for like 78 delay is worth it. I dont think takeing that long to fire is worht it imo, specially if you are just trying to pop an acid rq.
And I dunno, lots of people complain about being too full on gear all the time, 57-59/60 constantly. Granted the arguement lets use a worse peice of gear sounds kinda bad, but if you are aiming for an effiency point, Snipers > toreadors I think is one of those items that stands in that point. Im at 50/60 and Id really like to minimize that ALOT, but I cant. If I were to carry chargers and toreadors thats another 2. In an effort to streamline I stopped carrying alot of "perfection/maximizing" gear.
About the bow: I think what thfs want to aim for is Quickness and Racc, the lower delay allows for spamming bolts faster, and the loss of 1 racc(2 agi?) for like 78 delay is worth it. I dont think takeing that long to fire is worht it imo, specially if you are just trying to pop an acid rq.
And I dunno, lots of people complain about being too full on gear all the time, 57-59/60 constantly. Granted the arguement lets use a worse peice of gear sounds kinda bad, but if you are aiming for an effiency point, Snipers > toreadors I think is one of those items that stands in that point. Im at 50/60 and Id really like to minimize that ALOT, but I cant. If I were to carry chargers and toreadors thats another 2. In an effort to streamline I stopped carrying alot of "perfection/maximizing" gear.
#27
Posted 13 February 2007 - 11:49 PM
Wasn't getting on your case about gear choice, just saying that they way a Thf gears is not just the gear it's self as it is the race of the thf. If you ar taru/mithra you are bottom of the base str, if you are galka/elvaan you are top of the str and hume is just...plain. People don't just look at gear and say because this has points all over it it must be the best, they look at gear and their race and go "I could use this, but I also suffer here a little more then what this has to offer" So ya kinda gotta look at the race of the poster when they don't exactly agree with your set up. Don't take it personally, not everyone agrees with one another which is a good reason why you put in multiple choices for gear, but just take into account each person will play according to their race strengths/weakness also.
#28
Posted 14 February 2007 - 12:52 AM
Because I feel that DEX and STR are not particularly important while meleeing, and we're talking about a max difference of 5.5 accuracy (elvaan vs. mithra) and 5 atk (elvaan vs. tarutaru), I don't see racial differences as particularly important when choosing gear.
#29
Posted 14 February 2007 - 09:05 PM
Good call making the thread, collecting all the old info in 1 place. Sort of a 'running poll' 
- If I understand it correctly though, you would say blau/siro > P.harpe/blau..? Blau chosen to main from the 1st list, removing it from 2nd, siro up next..
- I agree with treelo on the hollow vs ethereal ear issue. Considering the only stat on ethereal worthwhile during melee for thf, is outdone by other options even. Ethereal only kinda worthwhile solo imo. And still not THAT worthwhile over other options.
- Seeing that you gave pieces with more acc priority in cases of tying, i take it that meat is the assumed food? (Didn't want to assume)
- Race doesn't matter in gear and stat choices and priorities anymore..?
I look forward to the fine tunings of this & upcoming lists
- If I understand it correctly though, you would say blau/siro > P.harpe/blau..? Blau chosen to main from the 1st list, removing it from 2nd, siro up next..
- I agree with treelo on the hollow vs ethereal ear issue. Considering the only stat on ethereal worthwhile during melee for thf, is outdone by other options even. Ethereal only kinda worthwhile solo imo. And still not THAT worthwhile over other options.
- Seeing that you gave pieces with more acc priority in cases of tying, i take it that meat is the assumed food? (Didn't want to assume)
- Race doesn't matter in gear and stat choices and priorities anymore..?
I look forward to the fine tunings of this & upcoming lists
#30
Posted 14 February 2007 - 10:22 PM
May want to put the Potent Belt in before the Life Belt, but I don't think that 2 acc outweighs 3 str.
#31
Posted 15 February 2007 - 02:18 AM
olddog :
Good call making the thread, collecting all the old info in 1 place. Sort of a 'running poll'
- If I understand it correctly though, you would say blau/siro > P.harpe/blau..? Blau chosen to main from the 1st list, removing it from 2nd, siro up next..
- I agree with treelo on the hollow vs ethereal ear issue. Considering the only stat on ethereal worthwhile during melee for thf, is outdone by other options even. Ethereal only kinda worthwhile solo imo. And still not THAT worthwhile over other options.
- Seeing that you gave pieces with more acc priority in cases of tying, i take it that meat is the assumed food? (Didn't want to assume)
- Race doesn't matter in gear and stat choices and priorities anymore..?
I look forward to the fine tunings of this & upcoming lists
Good call making the thread, collecting all the old info in 1 place. Sort of a 'running poll'
- If I understand it correctly though, you would say blau/siro > P.harpe/blau..? Blau chosen to main from the 1st list, removing it from 2nd, siro up next..
- I agree with treelo on the hollow vs ethereal ear issue. Considering the only stat on ethereal worthwhile during melee for thf, is outdone by other options even. Ethereal only kinda worthwhile solo imo. And still not THAT worthwhile over other options.
- Seeing that you gave pieces with more acc priority in cases of tying, i take it that meat is the assumed food? (Didn't want to assume)
- Race doesn't matter in gear and stat choices and priorities anymore..?
I look forward to the fine tunings of this & upcoming lists
I do think Blau/Sirocco > P. Harpe/Blau, yes.
I feel that both Hollow and ethreal are worse than Merman for melee, so I don't see it as a particularly imporant issue for this argument, but any of the 3 will be fine.
For merits, yes I am trying to build a situation where meat is desired. Red Curry destroys Sole or Squid sushi on a "points" basis, so yeah I want to use the highest "points" available.
I wasn't aware that race was ever a significant factor.
I'm glad you enjoy the list.
olddog :
May want to put the Potent Belt in before the Life Belt, but I don't think that 2 acc outweighs 3 str.
May want to put the Potent Belt in before the Life Belt, but I don't think that 2 acc outweighs 3 str.
It's a rough one. Same question for Barbarossa's Zerehs vs. Homam pants.
Potent = 3 STR vs. 2 ACC on lifebelt. Barbarossa's Zerehs = 4 STR vs. 3 ACC on Homam. I stuck with the "points" (2 acc > 1.5 atk, 3 acc > 2 atk) on each, but it was a rough call. If you are in some T-VT meritpo party and you happen to have all the rest of this gear, you may want to swap in some STR if you are parsing at 90+% with meat. I ...just don't see it happening often though, if ever, so I give the ACC the edge.
#32
Posted 15 February 2007 - 10:39 AM
This is good stuff. Maybe in a few weeks you can reword the intro just so people know that this is via the judgment of you and a few others' opinions, as a guide(which you stated), and this can get stickied. Because clearly everybody is going to value acc here and attack there differently. Don't want to waste a good idea on one person's definition of right.
#33
Posted 15 February 2007 - 10:51 AM
I'd consider Hollow better than Mermans. Acc+4 > attack+6.
#34
Posted 15 February 2007 - 11:25 AM
I like giving accuracy the edge, but I just can't justify making 1 point of accuracy valued at more than 1.5 points of attack. Sometimes depending on your gear you will have to do so, especially if you are missing some of the "big" pieces like Love Torque or Homam Corazza, but I feel that valuing them equally 1:1 is the desired goal.
(Plus I don't really want to encourage people to pick Hollow.)
(Plus I don't really want to encourage people to pick Hollow.)
#35
Posted 15 February 2007 - 11:39 AM
<3 my hollow >.>
But I should have gotten ethereal really. When PLD hits 70's I'm gonna cry over my choices.
But I should have gotten ethereal really. When PLD hits 70's I'm gonna cry over my choices.
#36
Guest_Mirax_*
Posted 15 February 2007 - 11:43 AM
My main focus is on two pure sets of gear when I merit, TP and WS. TP is to hit as fast and ACC as possible, letting food and minuetes worry about my ATT / dot, therefore, I dont really agree with a points system. As being discussed in the other thread, and in others, there is an att cap on mobs. With dual minuetes, Redcurry(which is good to include) and a war in your party or two that use berserk every once in a while your attack is gonna be at the point where things like 3str on pieces, isnt really gonna matter, you arent gonna use those pieces for ws either. SO if you stack as much acc as you can, finding a comfortable harmony with haste gear, say 90-95% acc, then you'll benefit more from the higher attack given by food / minuets.
I carry many other pieces of switch just in case my acc isnt high enough with the classic homam(4)/turban doesnt parse acc high enough. Optical Hat / Turban / Homam Head. Swift Belt / Speed Belt / Life Belt. This is also why im in favor of Homam Hands > Dusk+1. 1% haste is amazing, but the 5att is worthless imo and 4acc is sooo nice, enabling your other attack boosters work so well with your 90-95%acc.
I carry many other pieces of switch just in case my acc isnt high enough with the classic homam(4)/turban doesnt parse acc high enough. Optical Hat / Turban / Homam Head. Swift Belt / Speed Belt / Life Belt. This is also why im in favor of Homam Hands > Dusk+1. 1% haste is amazing, but the 5att is worthless imo and 4acc is sooo nice, enabling your other attack boosters work so well with your 90-95%acc.
#37
Posted 15 February 2007 - 11:58 AM
If you are /nin, I really feel that you aren't going to have to worry about attack caps in meritpo. Only /war has to worry about this, and only when Berserk is up, which is valid.
Although, my 1:1 ratio is providing +56.3 accuracy - do people feel that sometimes they would want even more, even if it requires giving up haste% and attack? (like going homam hands over dusk+1). On IT trolls, Archain parses at 83-84% accuracy with +46 accuracy. Those are rough mobs. I feel that if my 1:1 system is providing, when optimized, over 85% accuracy rate even on some of the most evasive xp mobs, the ratio and points system is working. It's just, if you really do have all the gear in the game at your disposal, you really give up alot to tack a few more points of accuracy on, regardless of slot. Granted, Hollow > Merman would probably be the first thing to do, and given that you only wear either earring when /war and the 6 attack in a pwn meritpo party -might- be over the cap, so sure...
...but I still need more convincing I think. +56.3 accuracy is a shitload, especially when you are only 1% of haste away from the gear cap (skadi > homam) and have a ton of attack on top of it.
Man I'd love to see a beast of a thief with all this gear decimate some parsers.
Although, my 1:1 ratio is providing +56.3 accuracy - do people feel that sometimes they would want even more, even if it requires giving up haste% and attack? (like going homam hands over dusk+1). On IT trolls, Archain parses at 83-84% accuracy with +46 accuracy. Those are rough mobs. I feel that if my 1:1 system is providing, when optimized, over 85% accuracy rate even on some of the most evasive xp mobs, the ratio and points system is working. It's just, if you really do have all the gear in the game at your disposal, you really give up alot to tack a few more points of accuracy on, regardless of slot. Granted, Hollow > Merman would probably be the first thing to do, and given that you only wear either earring when /war and the 6 attack in a pwn meritpo party -might- be over the cap, so sure...
...but I still need more convincing I think. +56.3 accuracy is a shitload, especially when you are only 1% of haste away from the gear cap (skadi > homam) and have a ton of attack on top of it.
Man I'd love to see a beast of a thief with all this gear decimate some parsers.
#38
Posted 15 February 2007 - 12:01 PM
There's no way I'd value them at a 1:1 ratio.
285 skill
80 dex
+41 acc
Is less than 366 total accuracy (I believe the 85 skill above 200 is only 0.9 acc per point) to reach 80% accuracy.
So maybe the accuracy cap is in the 375-400 range. As Divis has tested, the attack cap is in the 650-800 range, depending on Dia level and mob type(though actually higher without dia). So when you add 1 accuracy you're adding a bigger percentage of that total amount than if you add 1 attack to its total amount. As well, hitting 2% more often will do more than adding a few attack in the highly fluctuating damage that pDIF gives you. Attack is only good to seek in large amounts.
285 skill
80 dex
+41 acc
Is less than 366 total accuracy (I believe the 85 skill above 200 is only 0.9 acc per point) to reach 80% accuracy.
So maybe the accuracy cap is in the 375-400 range. As Divis has tested, the attack cap is in the 650-800 range, depending on Dia level and mob type(though actually higher without dia). So when you add 1 accuracy you're adding a bigger percentage of that total amount than if you add 1 attack to its total amount. As well, hitting 2% more often will do more than adding a few attack in the highly fluctuating damage that pDIF gives you. Attack is only good to seek in large amounts.
#39
Posted 15 February 2007 - 12:17 PM
Besides your hollow > merman for non /nin-ing, do you feel that there are other places where accuracy is valuable enough to swap around gear choices in the chart? Are you a supporter of the homam > dusk+1 hands argument?
#40
Posted 15 February 2007 - 12:55 PM
I'm not sold on a 1:1 ratio either.
Looking at what benefits we can add to a naked THF:
Food: Up to 90~120 Attack (bison steak or red curry), or 45~55 Accuracy (sole or squid sushi)
Armor: Up to 100~110 Attack or 50~60 Accuracy
Songs: Up to 110~120 Attack or 45~55 Accuracy
Looking at what benefits we can add to a naked THF:
Food: Up to 90~120 Attack (bison steak or red curry), or 45~55 Accuracy (sole or squid sushi)
Armor: Up to 100~110 Attack or 50~60 Accuracy
Songs: Up to 110~120 Attack or 45~55 Accuracy
Share this topic:
Similar Topics
| Topic | Forum | Started By | Stats | Last Post Info | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Bold's awesome thread of awesomeness… and midget donkey pr0nz
|
Leviathan |
Boldfinger 
|
|
|
|
Japan, why the hell can't you name things normally?
Undernight In-Birth thread |
Other Games |
motoh
|
|
|
|
Signature Rating & Help Thread
|
Signature Request |
(havoc)
|
|
|
|
|
altana help please
|
The Underground |
Chifumi
|
|
|
|
|
Boot Camp Help and Questions please :)
|
FFXIV General Information |
Knida
|
|
