[D-a-r-k-H-e-l-l]

In the years that I have been playing ballista I have encountered many people that flat out run away in the middle of a 1 vs 1 due to negitive status effects or close to defeat. I am making this post because recently I have been dealing with groups of people that use "strategys" such as:

Side Stepping - Running around in circles

This is one of the most coward things you can do, it makes it nearly impossible to land a ws unless your using ranged, and completly messes up ranged attacks.


Spell Fading - Flat out running away

This is the most cowardly thing you can do in a 1 vs 1. Take your loss like a man, no one likes to run for 2 minutes to end a fight. I understand the need to sleep, bind and step away out of swinging range, but when you move so far away that it forces you to disengage thats just too much.





Iv been away from the game for a few months now, I don't even have the expansion and just had the fun of fighting a pld/dnc for the first time yesterday. Is there any other cheesy new combos or new running tactics people try to pull in solos?

[Liljoker]

Some people run and some dont... When i PvP with my rdm and people try to run around me i just make it harder for them, gravity is my best friend for that. =) anyways...yea,i hate when people sidestep or run really far away, or know they gonna lose and call a friend to help them..like one time i was fighting a pld and he called his drg friend over to double team...which failed horribly took them both at the same time lol...idk people like to cheat or try to cheat in PvP, never really changes.

[Shinsei]

Side Stepping - Running around in circles

This is one of the most coward things you can do, it makes it nearly impossible to land a ws unless your using ranged, and completly messes up ranged attacks.

I'm not advocating anything, but only merely commentin on your statement. Bringing it out like that, is saying "Man, I played this guy in Soul Calibur, I'm trying to do my unblockable move, and he fucking sidestep out of the way...what a fucking coward!"

Disregarding FFXI, majority of games where you have duels between 1 player and another, there's alot of sidestepping, "blocking", isnert any other move to avoid damage here.

Fighting Games? - From Sidestepping/strafing, jumping, ducking, parrying, attack reversals
Shooting Games? - Sidestepping, jumping, etc? avoiding the grenades, rocket launchers, random fire?


Now, you may say "well this is FFXI, is different" but why should the same "player vs player" mentality that's a result of other games change all of a sudden?


Again, I'm not trying to advocate anything, just bringing up a point

Eliminate strafing/sidestepping/jumping/ducking in fighting games? Then everyone will become succestible to every forms of attack, which is pretty retarded

Eliminate sidestepping from Shooting games...?....let's not even go there

Again, my main point is, when people are combatting each other, it's either kill or be killed, "omfg, stop jumping over my fireballs! wtf stay still!!"



Now in all seriousness - my perspective of this in FFXI

Sidestepping cowardly? Maybe? maybe so? but idc about it, whoever gets a ws off first, gets a good headstart, I just don't see it any different than avoiding rocket launchers in Halo, or strafing attacks in Tekken. Though I myself do not do it, but that's only because all the newbies would whine when it's so easy to handle.


Running Away around the match in a 1 vs 1 - my perspective of this in FFXI.

Well now this I find cowardly. To be more precise, let's say you're 1v1 starts off in um, the OP at jugner and forest, and somehow this guy is running take u all the way pass the hills n shit, and keeps at it. That's just plain cowardly.

[Cream Soda]

Only time I ever circle an opponent is when I don't feel like hitting a shield for 2 dmg.

[Shinsei]

Cream Soda :
Only time I ever circle an opponent is when I don't feel like hitting a shield for 2 dmg.

lol

[Tainted]

There's actually an art to properly circling a person. Either way, it's very easy to counter, if you're having such a hard time dealing with it maybe you should reconsider your strategy.

I guess it's also cowardly that I count the TP I'm giving a person, and how much TP they get so I can flash a WS since most people I know try to spam at 100%. Though, if I have a job that can't flash, I always make sure I try to run out of distance to range the WS. Sucks for them they don't try to do the same.

[Vijitt]

i dont like when ppl circle in a 1v1 but when ppl do it to me i just walk backwards. i seen Veg do it in one of his vids

[D-a-r-k-H-e-l-l]

I'm not advocating anything, but only merely commentin on your statement. Bringing it out like that, is saying "Man, I played this guy in Soul Calibur, I'm trying to do my unblockable move, and he fucking sidestep out of the way...what a fucking coward!"

Disregarding FFXI, majority of games where you have duels between 1 player and another, there's alot of sidestepping, "blocking", isnert any other move to avoid damage here.

Fighting Games? - From Sidestepping/strafing, jumping, ducking, parrying, attack reversals
Shooting Games? - Sidestepping, jumping, etc? avoiding the grenades, rocket launchers, random fire?


Now, you may say "well this is FFXI, is different" but why should the same "player vs player" mentality that's a result of other games change all of a sudden?


Again, I'm not trying to advocate anything, just bringing up a point

Eliminate strafing/sidestepping/jumping/ducking in fighting games? Then everyone will become succestible to every forms of attack, which is pretty retarded

Eliminate sidestepping from Shooting games...?....let's not even go there

Again, my main point is, when people are combatting each other, it's either kill or be killed, "omfg, stop jumping over my fireballs! wtf stay still!!"



Now in all seriousness - my perspective of this in FFXI

Sidestepping cowardly? Maybe? maybe so? but idc about it, whoever gets a ws off first, gets a good headstart, I just don't see it any different than avoiding rocket launchers in Halo, or strafing attacks in Tekken. Though I myself do not do it, but that's only because all the newbies would whine when it's so easy to handle.


Running Away around the match in a 1 vs 1 - my perspective of this in FFXI.

Well now this I find cowardly. To be more precise, let's say you're 1v1 starts off in um, the OP at jugner and forest, and somehow this guy is running take u all the way pass the hills n shit, and keeps at it. That's just plain cowardly.

Ok I used to be the biggest fighting game freak from the first mortal combat, first street fighter, all the way til they made straffing in half 3d to full 3d fighters such as virtual fighter, DoA 1-3. I currently play the shit out of Halo 3 (the reason most my friends on ffxi think I dropped dead) But to the point. Straffing/running around in circles in ffps and fighting games differs in ffxi because a simple reason, this game doesn't take much live action skill, you can't pop out a counter like its DoA, you can't croutch around the corner with a shotgun like its halo, and you damn sure don't miss because your aim is off. RPGs never require as much skills as ffps, or fighters, it take dedication and choices of gear job and sub, after that its almost as easy as pushing enter.

Only time I ever circle an opponent is when I don't feel like hitting a shield for 2 dmg.

I completely understand that, I basicaly only do that when I ws.



But after the years Iv been playing games online most if not all is the same, everyone plays to do anything to win, me and Urbanmyth got in a 2 on 2 halo ranked match where these guys got 1 kill up on us and then kept jumping off the map so we couldn't kill them, but thats just one of the "strategys". I believe in the fact that if you act this much like a coward on a video game, how do you act in real life? Alot more scarry things in real life then losing a solo in ballista.

[Skyrin]

Its very unfair to people with slow connection speeds. Running out of WS range is pretty bitch to, sry. Flashing and anything like that is actual smarts and perfectly acceptable imo.

[Shinsei]

Connection speed shouldn't even be a factor..... if you're lagging in a 1vs1 in FFXI......you need a new ISP and/or a new PC...it's 2007 for friggin sakes, you can afford a decent internet off MickeyD's money...if it's the latter, then oh well.

Anyways, it's like I said, if they consistently go in circles during a legit 1vs1, then yea, I'd find it retarded. But like I said, idc if whichever ass wanna do it, cause I can work around it.

[Aeonknight]

So it's annoying for you to be circled because it gives you a hard time trying to WS. Not only annoying, cowardly even.

But it's a-ok to do it to PLD (and MNK's Counterstance) since you don't feel like having to deal w/ a Shield?

Right...

I won't circle you if you don't circle me. But you're going to find that PLD are 10x harder to kill when you have to deal w/ that shield's full dmg mitigation ability.

[ShugotenshiOfOdin]

Cream Soda :
Only time I ever circle an opponent is when I don't feel like hitting a shield for 2 dmg.

Also when a MNK uses counterstance

[Kutsurabi]

lol Butt Hurtness is funny there are ways around it deal with it just because you can't beat someone the world isnt going to end, there are ways around every strat deal with it you lose it happens if you dont like someone that fights like this DONT FIGHT them MAYBE they will just learn from people not wanting to fight them and stop their "cheating" just to fight people and have fun in a GAME... omg yes its a game! i know huh?

Also Darkhell, add this to your post

Leaving the zone with the Pursuivant:

Flat out running away to the highest degree, take your loss like a man.

[Zealott]

Tainted :
There's actually an art to properly circling a person. Either way, it's very easy to counter, if you're having such a hard time dealing with it maybe you should reconsider your strategy.

I guess it's also cowardly that I count the TP I'm giving a person, and how much TP they get so I can flash a WS since most people I know try to spam at 100%. Though, if I have a job that can't flash, I always make sure I try to run out of distance to range the WS. Sucks for them they don't try to do the same.

here we go again with the "why dont you do it too or press arrow keys def" first off the only reason this rpg has free movement is because it had to, standard turn based couldent apply so SE put turn based into the equation as best they could, if strafeing was meant to be a part, mobs would not be able to turn face on a dime and would miss us if we strafe, but sorry to bust your bubble they dont, so obviously it is not a game mechanic but a little novelty that couldent be helped and was not intended.

Now we move onto ballista and all the whiners that throw a huge bitch fit when kiteing is not allowed in 1 v 1, i know its so tough on you to win a straight up fight, so you have to exploit a disadvantage that SE really did not intend but never seems to care enough to fix, first off "too far away" tp loss makes no practical sense when spells run on the same rules but simply say "too far away" and take no action at all, so in fact you are exploiting a big WOOPSIE! by SE and stamp skill on it and go on a relgious crusade to save it. That being said the arguement of "just manuver" is allso void, the sight range was made so narrow on purpose to stay true to the old turn based style of fighting FF games are known for, running around like a little bitch throws that off and makes it near impossible to get anything going off.

Allso on that note is this connection speed thing, true in some cases but in general that is not the problem, in the real sense of the game that you people struggle to grasp, its server time vs screen time, which allmost 100% of the time the server time is several secs ahead of what you see on screen. Thus what is 3 feet ahead of you on screen is 7 feet ahead in real time, thus makeing it impossible to do shit.

So in reality (sorry to burst your bubbles) you are exploiting a game defect and in a sense cheating your way into winning and lableing it skill to not lose face, i know you are going to cry, and whine and launch a holy crusade to save your souls but that is the fact of the matter.

[Shinsei]

You have your own points but comparing it with mobs is so different.


Here' some facts for you

When ballista first was released, and I'm talking dead first release, I was there. You know you could not hit a ws on a chasing target like you do now right? That was later added into a patch. You would get the too far away message if you weren't butt close humping the enemy, so they increased the distance for ws just a tid bit. So now, you're actually able to hit a moving target unlike how it was in the very first month or so it was released.

[SirrusAndShadshot]

Talk this out before you 1v1; "Rules of engagement" for this particular 1v1. That would avoid alot of trouble, personally when I dueled my friend Zona, we would make a point to be annoying and hard to hit(She was a DRK, I was a BLU, she would try to run out of range of my spells)

[Zealott]

i was allso there from the very start of P v P and i remember those terrible days when JPs exploited the piss out of that fact but my point is since then server lag has increased beyond a doubt and the distance is not allways enough to counter it. Allso this little probem could be avoided if SE makes WS run on the same rules as JAs and spells simply say "too far away" and no event occur. You make a valid point it is not as bad but with increaseing server lag its getin there.

[Tainted]

Zealott :

Tainted :
There's actually an art to properly circling a person. Either way, it's very easy to counter, if you're having such a hard time dealing with it maybe you should reconsider your strategy.

I guess it's also cowardly that I count the TP I'm giving a person, and how much TP they get so I can flash a WS since most people I know try to spam at 100%. Though, if I have a job that can't flash, I always make sure I try to run out of distance to range the WS. Sucks for them they don't try to do the same.

here we go again with the "why dont you do it too or press arrow keys def" first off the only reason this rpg has free movement is because it had to, standard turn based couldent apply so SE put turn based into the equation as best they could, if strafeing was meant to be a part, mobs would not be able to turn face on a dime and would miss us if we strafe, but sorry to bust your bubble they dont, so obviously it is not a game mechanic but a little novelty that couldent be helped and was not intended.

Now we move onto ballista and all the whiners that throw a huge bitch fit when kiteing is not allowed in 1 v 1, i know its so tough on you to win a straight up fight, so you have to exploit a disadvantage that SE really did not intend but never seems to care enough to fix, first off "too far away" tp loss makes no practical sense when spells run on the same rules but simply say "too far away" and take no action at all, so in fact you are exploiting a big WOOPSIE! by SE and stamp skill on it and go on a relgious crusade to save it. That being said the arguement of "just manuver" is allso void, the sight range was made so narrow on purpose to stay true to the old turn based style of fighting FF games are known for, running around like a little bitch throws that off and makes it near impossible to get anything going off.

Allso on that note is this connection speed thing, true in some cases but in general that is not the problem, in the real sense of the game that you people struggle to grasp, its server time vs screen time, which allmost 100% of the time the server time is several secs ahead of what you see on screen. Thus what is 3 feet ahead of you on screen is 7 feet ahead in real time, thus makeing it impossible to do shit.

So in reality (sorry to burst your bubbles) you are exploiting a game defect and in a sense cheating your way into winning and lableing it skill to not lose face, i know you are going to cry, and whine and launch a holy crusade to save your souls but that is the fact of the matter.

Lol, if it was really a game defect to be exploited, then it would have been fixed. A more recent game defect that was fixed were the recast timers on the new DRK spells. Things that are broken get fixed in a relatively short period of time. See where your logic fails since you can't fix what truly isn't broken?

So taking advantage of something that the game offers you is cheating? In theory, everybody has access to +movement speed gear. I guess though since everybody doesn't use it for whatever their reason may be, it is cheating to use that gear. Never mind that if you were to GM a person for "exploiting the game by not standing still in front of me" you would probably get jailed for cluttering the line for real problems.

It sounds to me like people who are too stupid to take full advantage of the game environment, be it because they want to be on some moral high horse, or they just don't know, are the only ones who have a problem. Because I mean, trying to disable a person from their full potential by moving out of the way is really wrong. I'm going to stand right in front of them so they have a chance to parry, block, guard, counter, etc. me. Not only that, I'm going to stand there and let a THF spam bloody bolts on me just because he can. I'm going to stand there and let them attack me even though they hit me four times faster for about the same damage I do to them. Not only that, I'm going to stand there and let them WS me when we're both at 100 HP, but he reached 100 TP one attack round before me. You're setting yourself up to lose by being a sucker.

And magic doesn't work the same way as using a TP move does. It moreso works like a normal attack does. Where as you don't lose or gain anything besides an attack round by being too far, you lose the inability to do anything at all for a short period if you ranged from a spell.

Go cry more, you can be a virtuous saint, I don't care. What matters is you're losing, and when you play against me it usually means I took some of your money for you being such a moral saint and losing the fight. You're the idiot for seeing me doing it and either finding a way to counter it or doing it yourself to force me to stop.

[Kutsurabi]

Zealott I get your points, but the fact that its a game defect is wrong and you have no right to state that it is.

SE uses range and movement all the time, they give us movement items range of spells being able to be cast and a radar built around mages casting range and a melee range and not being able to see the target and ranger range.

I'm a blu so people running around renders my spells useless all the time but stop complaining about it.


horrible post sorry

[Zealott]

Pretend logic is the worst sin of them all

Firt off you failed to come up with a feasible arguement instead all you managd was "IM RIGHT YOURE WRONG HOW DARE YOU SAY I EXPLOIT ANYTHING" but i guess it's idiots like you that make the world go round no?

Let us consider your "if it was a problem SE would fix it" def shall we, sure they fixed the drk glitch but that was a serious problem, haveing drks solo ITs just wouldent flay, but Se in all their wisdom doesnt bother with small erros that will cost them time and money, that being : too far away tp loss, allso take NPC freezeing for instance, a problem that took extreme pressureing for them to fix because they did not want to convert man hours.

Now moveing on "lets take advantage og the game environment everybody!" ok so by your logic, if any indeed exsists in you, we should all exploit gameing tools which by all means becomes part of the environment when installed does it not? just as much as playing with the server lag does, so i implore you: try again

You're under the impression i lose to pussies that play that way, well i dont really, because its all the weak people that do it, and evenmtually i win, so you can go on believeing i am crying, i just enjoy laughing at retards like you that insist exploiting server lag is "skill" and "tactical moves" get over yourself, untill you can come across a solid arguement other then "nope cant be true" dont bother posting.

might allso point out your "its not like spells" again way to read 10% of the post and "oh i need to write and angry letter now!" i included ranged attacks and job abilities which all run by the same rules ( if too far away your ability to act is temprarily halted) which tp should run by the same rules but since this game was formed around a non P v P environment they didnt consider that because mobs were not going to circle strafe you. yet again, please find a solid arguement


Allso let me point out some lovely controdictions "we should use the game environment!" "i wont stand still to get parried blocked etc" which are parts of the "game environment" legal parts i might add that were not made to be side stepped si9mply because SE's logic is based on turn based fighting, before i have to further waste my time in a long post just for you to not make any kind of coherent thought, i will end now, and again : keep trying to justify yourself, you only amuse me more.

@kuts i see your point kuts but you're speaking strictly mages, that will not lose mp if a too far away is hit, allso has many ways to stop movemnt IE: frypan, i am speaking strictly melee who are VERY limited in that respect, the main mode of attack (weaponskills) is like playing russian rullete, never knowing if you're goingto get lucky and server lag doesnt do you in.