[ToK Darius]

If I still played PLD, PLD/DNC ftw.
Same with SAM: It would either be SAM/RNG or SAM/DNC.

[Redd7x7]

Way too much theory crafting going on here about what works in Ballista. As soon as the match starts, all that strategy/techniques on paper about proper set up/gear, this and that all goes out the window.

Truth is the smarter, more balanced team wins. Being pimped out, in "proper" gear set up and such amounts to nothing when your team is running around unorganized and getting ganked every few seconds.

With that said, play the game how you like as long as team work is paramount in your priorities. From my limited experience, great team work has just about always ensured victory. Nice gear and "right" gear setups can only dream of that victory.

Hey, we are here to have fun, right? Right...? And I like the music in this video. I know my music selection rarely settles well with most folks but meh, we all can't like the same thing.

(I just find it funny how so many people think that in Ballista you are only restricted to attacking a PLD from the front. Good Lord...God forbid you can move around your target.)

Anyway, go have fun.

[QuertoPanda]

Im gonna ignore the pld discussion and go straight to the guy who said why not gsword.......god maroon, its 60 cap, gsword would be the dumbest thing ever, and if you have to ask why, GTFO my ballista

My sarcasm wasn't very obvious? :> Maybe i should have said staph

[Angel of Enders]

*staff

[Tainted]

Geo' sounds like my kind of person to take sides with.

Seriously... Shield ISN'T processing for any on you PLD's in Ballista? lol

Ironguy uses Tachi: Kasha (130 STR by base with no Hasso/food, Hagun, Al'taieu gorget).
The Fomor Paladin takes 276 points of damage.

COMPARED TO, the EVER NOT-SO COMMON(read: NEVER) whenever I happen to fight these assholes,

Ironguy uses Tachi: Kasha (no Berserk/no DA/nothing special besides with what you read above).
The Fomor Paladin takes 1078 points of damage.

I literally use Hobaku>Gekko on these motherfuckers as well when Sekkanoki's around, JUST to make sure their shield doesn't process; it's that overwhelming against my damage (though granted in Ballista, since the Sekkanoki "adjustment", there's basically no point in using Sek', or you're just due for a missed weapon skill).

Soboro' Yukikazes in sixty caps range from like... 60~(blocked) to 290~(not blocked, but still at its peak definately). Hate to say it, but if you're facing the target the whole time (and when the FUCK are you retarded enough to NOT be facing your target as a PLD), you blocking the damage from all the swings alone is worth more than when Utsu' goes down and you're eating dick because you can't get 'Ichi through.



Yeah... all I recall ever were the standard numbers you'd see with any non-buffed one-handed WS that relies on statistics heavily, and that was like 250-400 tops. Pictures please?



Perhaps I'm behind on the times, but... 60PLD/NIN hitting 500+ DEF wut? Unless you're downing T.Taco, I -really- don't see that number even being remotely close, and even then: you're giving up the majority of your "DD PLD" equipment, without question, to benefit the overthought defense number.



Without your shield? Eh... good luck trying to live against three Penta Thrusts back to back, eh?

And this includes interrupting your castings easily enough, barring the one slim IV you might get off due to a quick Flash. But you know what's even MORE fun as a Samurai to do against a Paladin using 'tacos: Evasion SAM/DNC. Goddamn that guy hated me /disengaging and /dance4'ing infront of him quick there before slamming Yukikaze into him again with him at about 7%~ HP (except Yukikaze was blocked because he had his shield, so it took another good three attack rounds to get 100% TP again and throw another at him and actually kill him).

On that note: dimming Faith' MNKs down to 10-15~ a hit, compared to the usual 40-50 (+70 crit') = Defense is useless, right?

I honestly don't see why everybody's all in fret over SAM/RNG either... I decked my /RNG out completely (and still -do- have it decked to this day), and it STILL falls short to just about any support job in conjunction with a polearm (although Rana's made Hagun/Soboro' sexy again for this kind of thing ), weither it be sixty or uncapped. Utsu' doesn't mean shit when the SAM's just going to tear it down in two attacks rounds npnp too (one if they triple attack), so why not... go /BLU and Cocoon that motherfucker like Vegetto would (demonstrated in a bunch of his videos that he put out, really showing how lol SAM/RNG actually is). That, or EVA-ish job and EVA build, gogo (KILL THE DICKWADS RELENTLESSLY SO THEY DON'T HAVE ANY SUSHI LEFT EITHER)!

How are you mixing 60 and uncap together when they're two completely different games? If you can't even argue straight, there's no point in arguing with you then since idiots can't stop being idiots.

Anyway, regular numbers? Dude, did you even watch my video? Go pause the video a little after 1:00.

Here's another one though that I've had a picture of for months now.



Sorry but my PLD pushes far beyond average numbers at 60.

SAM/DNC evasion build at 60? Good luck with that, my balanced build is balanced solely to take down evasion NIN and THF with out sushi. Then again I assume you're probably mixing up 60 cap and uncap again, and even in uncap your Samurai evasion build isn't going to mean shit to me in terms of my ACC on PLD. Maybe my THF who has no weapon merits and doesn't gear offensively, but not my decked out PLD. ^^

Because MNK gets Faiths in 60 cap.

Go watch my other video where I blink tank a soboro SAM/RNG WITH mistakes and I'm never under pressure.

Go watch my videos where I prolong the attack round of a sword/shield PLD to that of my dual wield swords. During that time, he couldn't face me for a shield block. He was trying his hardest to get it to happen but guess what, I wasn't standing still either.

I never said my 60 PLD/NIN has 500 DEF. I don't need it since you don't have any ATK while I'm still able to break 500+ damage on your SAM/BLU even with cocoon. The only reason PLD/BLU is effective at all in 60 cap is because of the phalanx from the shield. With out the phalanx, your DEF is pretty much pointless. You'd be better going SAM/WAR to be a thousand times more versatile while still able to have a similar DEF buff from defender that can't be dispelled with D level marksmanship.

Live against 3 penta thrusts with no shield? That's cake walk. Sentinel or range them, why would I just stand there and let you do it? Good luck standing there and taking 3 penta thrusts to the sides with a shield on.

I'm wondering do you even play 60 cap, or do you and everyone else just suck at 60 cap and try to play at it in exp gear or like it were no cap.

[Geothermal]

I still don't quite get the argument being thrown around that shield will rarely proc because the enemy won't be standing still. Okay fine, if they have any shred of intelligence they'll try to avoid shield, I get that. But since when do you as the Paladin have to stand there like a retard? It's as simple as locking onto the target, and holding back on the analog stick. The game automatically centers yourself onto the enemy. Not to mention the lolcows that use the merry-go-round tactic on you just end up encumbering themselves with the "Out of range" message if they try that while you do it, and when they DO manage to attack you, you will be facing them because you are not the product of your mother also being your sister, and likely will have shield proc for the ever impressive 15 damage scythe swing.

And in the far more likely situation of multiple enemies, well, that's even less supportive of PLD/NIN, since unless you are the luckiest motherfucker on the field, you won't get off an Ichi cast with two people hitting you, unless those two people are wielding a heavy delay weapon and hitting almost totally in sync.

[Tainted]

And you keep walking back into a wall and the person with any shred of intelligence will stand back out of range to force you away from the wall, making you run forward to them.

And good luck getting multiple shield blocks on two people since you want to assume they're both attacking you from the front unless you're really lucky to be against a wall and they don't care since they're still going to rape you anally or they're both just idiots. You know, I'd rather you be against the wall against two people, because now it's even EASIER to attack your side.

[Geothermal]

Why would a PLD/WAR be baited into such an obvious mistake? Wait no, why would anyone go out of their way to put themselves at a disadvantage? If the opponent wants to stand there and look at me from afar like a stalker, they're more than welcome to, even moreso if they're a fairly useful job to their side, I've effectively dismantled one player just because they are in an unfavorable position until they give up and run off. Perhaps if they were NIN, THF, competent WAR, competent SAM, that kind of shit with ranged attack there would be an issue, but discretion IS the better part of valor, and it wouldn't exactly be uncommon for said Paladin to retreat, assuming they were not stupid and engaged in this theoretical, unlikely 1 v 1 situation without Petras for Sprint. One could argue that the opponent did too, but if they took the bait of chasing you, once again the lock-on + back on the analog stick fiasco continues, talk about futility incarnate.

Not to mention in areas like Pashow and the southern portion of Meriphataud, there's not really any walls to speak of aside from the zones walls themselves, I could end up fucking moonwalking across the map if I so chose to.

With multiple enemies, and you alone, it's obvious you are going to retreat, unless you're up against a BRD and a WHM or something. The point I was making was as a PLD/NIN, it is all the more urgent to escape from such a situation. They have no Shield for the possibility of a block, no Defender for damage mitigation, no Provoke to stop the more dangerous JAs(lolMeditate) and if the /WAR was wise, he brought along a Spartan Hoplon that he uses whenever the cooldown timer is up. That's getting dangerously into the conjecture and speculation portion of this hypothetical situation though, so it's rather irrelevant. And if you do not run away, then /WAR would still last longer and prolong the inevitable, shield not procing or otherwise.

/NIN is arguably the better DD with comparative gear, but I don't really know why you're trying to argue that it can tank better or equal to /WAR. PLD/NIN is a hybrid that is offense first, defense second. PLD/WAR is the polar opposite.

[Tainted]

Theoretical? Yes. Unlikely? No

And when you think about it, after baiting you into putting yourself in this position to think I can't overcome you shield. I simply move in for one attack around then move out. You're taking damage, I'm not. If you try to run away to fix your backwards moving strategy, I maintain my distance and keep moving in and out as I have been doing. Trying to move back, wall or not, puts you at an even bigger disadvantage to somebody determined to bait you into chasing them.

PLD/NIN can still equip a shield. But for the sake of argument, a PLD with a shield would retreat at the same time the same way a PLD with two swords would retreat against multiple enemies. Again, I've got evidence that a PLD/NIN can handle multiple enemies with out retreating through my videos(Namely the first Jugner one).

PLD/WAR gains no defensive traits besides Defender(which one can argue doesn't even do anything) over PLD/NIN. They get an ATK bonus(offset by off-handing TM+2), and Berserk, which doesn't produce equal numbers to the extra hit from the off-hand sword, or DA, which in reality rarely happens and even then still fails to produce the digits. PLD.NIN clearly holds the advantage defensively and offensively over PLD/WAR.

[Balderach]

Hey Tainted~

[Tainted]

Hey Bald, you suck. Start playing again and come to Fairy.

[Balderach]

Yo I came back! I don't wanna server transfer though lol Come back to cerb and bring Faf~

[IronPandemonium]

Quote trainnn

The hell's so different about sixty and uncapped? It's still kill or be killed in the long run; only real exceptions though are that /NIN's only getting one Utsu' spell, DEF builds are -slightly- lower (as well as offense builds), and evasion builds are actually useful outside of sushi users. Your shield's still going to block as well.

This doesn't really help, because for all I know, the guy's got Berserk on as well as having piss-poor equipment in general (hi there 50~ a hit with what I assume's a WAR/NIN with axes). I'll tell you, there was this Galka PLD/NIN in a majorly offensive build (Byrnie, Pallas', Bloodsword etc) in sixty caps that use to be present, and with his shadows down and no Sentinal? Slam 90~ a hit into him with a Couse no problem, while average a good 700~ Penta' without buffing the damn thing. And quite franklly? More of an annoyance then a threat, reaching about 300~ Vorpal' tops on anybody actually ready to take a hit, compared to that Ranger in your video you basically one-shotted with Fire Staff and /WAR 'zerk I bet (wtf @ +100 with NORMAL hits on him/her at first?).

SAM/DNC evasion build at 60? Good luck with that, my balanced build is balanced solely to take down evasion NIN and THF with out sushi. Then again I assume you're probably mixing up 60 cap and uncap again, and even in uncap your Samurai evasion build isn't going to mean shit to me in terms of my ACC on PLD. Maybe my THF who has no weapon merits and doesn't gear offensively, but not my decked out PLD. ^^

That's my point: With that kind of equipment going on as a PLD/NIN, anybody that can bother mowing through your shadows quick is easily going to drop your HP to half with one weapon skill (as long as they're not trigger happy enough to fire it off after you use Sentinal). Example: hi2u @ 1:24-1:40. Again, might I add, evasion builds in uncapped are useless these days (even on Thief itself).

Monks don't get Faiths in sixty cap, that's a given, but what does it matter when it's still dimming the most DPS-friendly job to a measly number itself? That there was just an example how much time it can take to kill somebody who actually bothers with a defensive spin on their setup.

I never said my 60 PLD/NIN has 500 DEF. I don't need it since you don't have any ATK while I'm still able to break 500+ damage on your SAM/BLU even with cocoon. The only reason PLD/BLU is effective at all in 60 cap is because of the phalanx from the shield. With out the phalanx, your DEF is pretty much pointless. You'd be better going SAM/WAR to be a thousand times more versatile while still able to have a similar DEF buff from defender that can't be dispelled with D level marksmanship.

I'll be damned if I ever see Vorpal' come even close to 500 average against 500 DEF, that's what I'll say to that. Fully decked PLD/NIN (Homam, Haubergeon +1, Justice'/Joyeuse) in uncapped couldn't even break 250 against 620, but that's beside the point that he'd be dead within seconds, due to once again, without the freaking shield. Does get me thinking though: Does Atonement even work in Ballista properly.

Now, the spinning trick would work against a shield, but seriously would anybody let that happen? Anyone who tries that shit on me (sup 15 away from cap parrying being bitchy luckily), I just backstep the whole time, and it keeps me looking at them with no problem period. And you're telling a Samurai to go /WAR, where the Defender deducts attack itself? You cancel it as well, and it's gone for a noteable amount of time, y'know. While it IS true Acid Bolts null Cocoon, that's where the evasion build comes in handy (and if uncapped, they still have to deal with 20-30% physical damage reduction appropriately).

Finally though, the funny thing... Sentinal wears after thirty seconds (noteable gone even after twenty'). You think I, or anybody for that matter, would just keep forking out the worthwhile attacks while that's up? WAIT for it to wear, THEN eat your face with +450 no problem (and luckily waste abit of your curing MP as well by chipping a Flash or two off). Note though, the three Penta's before-mentioned were just considered alone from running in with one ready and using Meditate for the other two. Still need to take another one or two before you're dead, if you're willing to stick around long enough (by staying alive and/or not running) for them.

I'm not ADVOCATING you must go /WAR, /BLU, or even /WHM to sixty caps (or /RDM to uncapped), but the way I see it after I watch that five minute video, is you're cruising for a bruising if I (or anyone with similar thinking) were on Fairy and saw a PLD as /NIN with dual swords. You enjoy /NIN dual wield? That's fine, but don't justify it like it's actually groundbreaking compared to the other support jobs that work with PLD/.

[Elvene]

fenrir's not as bad as some people say :|

[Tainted]

What's so different about the two? The gear that becomes available easily changes the way both are played and the selection of gear used. If you can't see this, then we're not playing the same game.

The ranger switched to earth staff, and I would have landed between 500-600 again in the one other shot in the video if he had enough HP for me to even land a full WS. And how are you going to say the WAR was zerked? If he was zerked, why was his damage so low against my completely offensive build? You're grossly trying to exaggerate numbers to prove your point, which is retarded. Looking at my video, I didn't even take huge amounts of damage. Yeah, the RNG landed barrage and a sidewinder on me because I wasn't paying attention, that's it. Other then that, from Ise's war, I wasn't tanking huge numbers like you claim I would be. Ise's war is definitely more hybrid in terms of offense/defense than your SAM/BLU could ever be.

And I hit most peole for 60+ each sword, lower DEF players like THF are always ranging 80-100 per sword. Stop trying to find excuses, just admit you were wrong about the DD capability.

Hell, I'm even popping digits in fucking 50 cap.



I have a reputation amongst old school people from Cerb where my damage output in ballista is second to none, pre and post WS nerf. Deal with people who trump your "best offense is defense" bullshit with "best offense is digits".

My PLD shits on MNK DPS at 60 EASILY. Not to mention I have about as much HP as the average MNK to begin with, better DEF, all but a very few are outclassed TOTALLY by my PLD/NIN.

And guess what? Stop comparing 60 cap gear to uncap gear retard.

Fully decked out in homam, justice sword, etc. doesn't offer digits like a fully decked out 60 cap PLD can. The gear choice is ENTIRELY different.

I've stomped PLD/WAR as /NIN. I've stomped /BLU as /NIN. I've stomped /WHM as /NIN. Let me put it like this.

You're a fucking retard who doesn't have any numbers to back yourself up. PLD/NIN doesn't take loads of damage, it takes the SAME amount of damage any time any other PLD choice doesn't get a shield block or have phalanx up. Which surprisingly so, happens to be the majority of the time/

[Jormungand]

Bravo, Ironpandemonium, I've never seen someone take ideas that bad and make them worse. You have a gift, I'll give you that.

Your damage calculations are at the very least...pulled directly from your ass. I highly doubt they have any real foundation on any server, field, or situation. Your ideas on shields have got to be equally fabricated, giving references to fighting a paladin formor gives little to no merit to your argument. It's as if you've only considered the fact that a paladin will always know which direction every attack comes from and will only be fighting one person.

The conditions you state are...unlikely, for example...if a paladin were to use sentinel I can guarantee you that 30 seconds will be enough to either, get away so you'll never have the opportunity to spam penta, or finish whatever they're doing and still get away. Not to mention you didn't even consider the fact that flash is an option or mages...or hell..other people.

I'm sorry to say, that what you do is advocate. You can't say what must and must not be done, you're not even close to being qualified.

Anyone who plays ballista will tell you that...there's more than one person and the attacks do not always come from the front.

Aggressive Tainted, bit too aggressive. Sorry Elvene, you need better representatives. T-T

[Ghast]

The fact that Tainted bothers to post all this and still pulling 10+ hours a day on FFXI makes me realize he's still and will always be the little geek that couldn't. Tainted keep bragging about your video game "triumphs", it'll be all you'll ever have. I sure hope those part-time jobs at Subway will pay the bills when you're in your 30's. Life's not a video game hun, you won't find people to pay for everything you need like you do e-whoring yourself on FFXI. I still remember that Sairyu mt in ls chat with a line from his cybersession with you, that was priceless. Whatever happened to lolellipsis? Does that little kid still play? I'm guessing he found out you weren't a girl? You'll forever be a joke and a waste of resources, and the sooner you admit that burying your sorrows in a game won't help you the sooner you can start achieving goals that really matter.

Oh and Balderach, you fat and fugly mutant - where do you even find the audacity to leave the house? You're the most disgusting thing to set foot on Earth. It's no wonder you keep returning to the game, you realize the lack of an outside life is driving you to near suicide.

I love you all for entertaining me on a rather boring night. God bless

[Geothermal]

I thought everything that could possibly be said has been said, but saying /NIN takes the same amount of damage as any other choice without shield block or Phalanx is just plain wrong. And yes, that is a fact. Defender, despite you questioning its usefulness, mitigates damage a noticeable amount. After all, it's a 25% Defense boost from your max DEF, considering even the gimpiest of DEF oriented Paladins will have 300 Defense, that's +75 Defense. And if you scoff at that amount, you really need to go back to the drawing board on Paladin, considering our niche is soaking up, and laughing at damage that would have the paper thin other jobs shitting themselves. People end up spending 2mil extra simply for an extra 2 ACC, I wonder how much they would pay for +75 Defense at level 60.

Not saying that we should only stick to bloodtanking, so don't try to pull that card, but it's a rather good idea to emphasize your strengths. Same with Berserk, +25% Attack is great when people circlejerk over the +22% Attack Meat Mithkabob gives. You can claim we're not giving /NIN the credit it deserves, but that shit comes right back at you with /WAR.

And it's obvious from the TP return you got from that Blade: Chi had some favorable critical hit/double attack proc'ing, which is a dick move. I could sit here posting pictures of my SAM doing 1000 damage Tachi: Gekko's on other SAMs and shit, but it's irrelevant when windower shows I recieved a lucky goddamn 19 TP return. Same with Vorpal Blade, I've put up numbers that even turned Warriors heads, but it's with added TP return. That shit is not reliable, unless you're going to claim you WS for Crit/DA TP return more than 50% of the time.

Have you tried PLD/WAR in Ballista? I'm getting the sinking feeling you have not, or you did when it wasn't buffed. I have played both, and while I love the aspect of /NIN doing fairly formidable damage while being able to cure myself because of incompetent healers and taking comparatively low damage from the enemy, /WAR has more than enough reason to use it.

[Tainted]

I already listed the things /WAR gets over /NIN, which is pretty much nothing.

You're trying to see results from defender when there really aren't any. I scoff at it because I already totally wreck it.

SAM breaking 1k damage in uncapped isn't something special. In fact, it's actually really easy to do against most jobs. It's expected. Any job pre-2 hand buff breaking 500 in 50 cap is something cool. When that job is NIN, it's even better considering they don't have access to penta thrust. Dismissing something trying to say "Oh you just DA" when most people DA Chi won't break that is kind of, I dunno, is rather stupid.

If you can't produce equal numbers to /NIN as /WAR while using the same food and having berserk up, and even then getting a DA, I guess that says a lot about the capability of /WAR.

There's little reason to go /WAR over /NIN when the only thing /WAR has to offer is defender, and that makes no difference at all.

[babyboy]

i give this a great rating of....3/10

It just looked like you going after the same people over and over, cause i've never seen you do that before (lol). Your .dat swaps arent cool. At all. Change them. Now. As for your playstyle with pld...i see where your going with it and its not a bad idea..its just you need to excel at it with more teamwork then just running like the juggernaut bitch..you know what i mean. And as for the music..its god awful. period.
end of discussion.









EDIT: "I have a reputation amongst old school people from Cerb where my damage output in ballista is second to none" Since when?