[stubbieunicornserver]

I'll start off by saying that I have not played consistently in roughly 16 months, i've played but nothing more than log in and craft or perhaps do a random LS event, nothing heavily time consuming like exp'ing, Lately I've found myself having much more free time and seeking merits on my jobs, usually i start off seeking on monk for like eternity and when no invites i'll switch up to bard...

Every merit group I have joined recently has consisted of somehthing like RDM BRD DRG/SAM DRG/SAM SAM/WAR SAM/NIN or something very similar with SAM and DRG being mainly the only jobs i see.

Do you other bards actually like this? I find it to be a headache and a half, the last time i exp'd much people still invited jobs like MNK/NIN and WAR/NIN to merits for DoT value. These recent parties of mine I have found myself completely out of mobs to pull at birds, even if no other parties camp, trying desperately to pull off 2 songs before a mob dies, not always successfully, and then having to seek for repops to pull, breaking chains simply due to complete overkill dmg.

I recall pulling 100+ chains and singing to be so much easier in single bard setups involving wars and mnks and perhaps throw in one SAM or DRG, I'm not saying i don't think SAM and DRG are viable jobs for bird camps but - is it really necessary to have the party consist solely of them? Or is it more detrimental to exp?

I don't even want to get into other problems i've had with party setups consisted purely of these 2 jobs but i will anyway, Lack of provoke is seriously disturbing when you pull mobs and they run off after you as your seeking your next target making it two mobs on you rather than just 1 being pulled.Or also when the mage has to cure a melee at the start of a fight - its just too much like the doons

To me i think a party should be well balanced between spike dmg and DoT, if these people want that much spike dmg they better have a 2nd bard from now on to help with the mage set of songs or i will refuse is all i can say.

I'm not looking to start any arguments or flame wars here, i just want to know other bards opinions regarding WTF i should do here, i actually enjoy partying as bard, but i cannot stand the stress of overkill parties which i am seeing more and more of, these fuckers clear the entire zone in 5 minutes then cry they dont get 100+ chains

[pathwriter]

I've had the same problems as you and, indeed, cannot seem to get a merit party on my Monk anymore (this was not the case a few months ago in which I almost had to go /anon on Monk but not on Bard, if you can believe that). I posed this problem to the Samurai forum and in their typically unhelpful way, they said to either pull the Wivres or move to a "real merit camp," whatever the fuck that means. Yes, I can clear Mamool Ja Staging Point somewhat, but the damage output and problems involved (e.g., having to grab a Skoffin and, oh fuck, it just Paralyzed the whole fucking zone) can break a chain as badly as waiting desperately on respawns.

What seems to have been lost on parties lately is that merit parties do better when they maintain chains rather than simply killing fast. This was well known a year ago but as Samurai has become more and more popular, egos start getting in the way.

As for Provoke... what the fuck is Provoke? I have to BEG for that shit. I can and have pulled high chain parties as /Red Mage, but I sure as fuck can't do that anymore since not a damned person will peel the mob off me so I can rebuff and go pull.

I really think it's forum ego problems. If you get into a good party, it's almost certainly with people who read KI or BG. I know a lot of people who refuse to merit without a Bard or, more often, two Bards or a Bard and Corsair, who refuse to sub anything other than Warrior (if Samurai) or Samurai, and who don't invite a one-handed weapon user anymore. It's all wank because the notion of efficiency and cooperation gets tossed out the window when worrying about putting out the biggest Penta Thrust or Tachi: Gekko.

[Ryukin]

to be honest, i merit on sam a lot, but i leveled bard to merit, bard is by far the most fun meriting since i'm not just zoning out going "oh i have over 100% tp, forgot to press my macro" i actually have to pay attention. when i merit on bard i always ask for mnks and wars STILL, then my friends being the over l337est they are go "lolmnks", i'm like, wtf, a BB mnk can keep up with a good war and shit.

but as for the not being able to cast songs, i know how you feel. i used yigit body and minstrils ring, helps an ass load. i usually pull, then as the mob is taking its sweet time to get to the DD, i cast one song, sleep it, then go out and find another bird. i just do one song at a time each time i pull.

and about running out of mobs, if your DD are clearing the zone, they should be able to kill wivre in birds camps. if they can't, then thats just weird to be good enough to clear a zone but not a "tiny" bit tougher mob, or be a dick like i sometimes and and steal a bird from lower camps. i hate doing, i only do it if its a shity party on the other camp aka lvl 74's that have half the birds up still.

and like path said, a DD may not pt without a brd, i wont pt w/o a voke, but my only thing is, voke off the damn bird. hate that shit coming after me when i run away then they go "nuu we lost chain QQ".

[Saxonian]

I hate it when people try and force me to sub sam on my War... You can get the same exp at a more comfortable rate just by subbing nin and going full out and not sponging mp.
To be honest some of the worse parties i've been in have been, Drg, Drg, Sam, War, Brd, Rdm. All melee subbing sam (or war in the sam's case), and the whole party was such an mp sink the Rdm didn't have enough mp to even haste the melee.

[stubbieunicornserver]

Yah, it does seem a major trend these days that people want a mob dead the second it reaches camp and no less, I guess i'm going to probably want to build my own parties from now on, refuse certain setups if invited and in general just be more of a dick, because i can, because i am bard. lol

Actually because of this tend I have lately been putting things like:
"2x Bard only"
"Fisherman No Thanks"
and
"/WHM only"

in my search comment, just because i feel that these overkill parties work much smother with 2 pullers, 2 sets of songs, and the fact that i can backup cure the MP sponges being that i can max around 700MP as /whm with dalmy and all that shit

I do miss the days of wars and monks in merits, chains were held up much more smoothly, again i dont mean SAM or DRg is a bad job - it's just fuckingretardedoverkill to have more than one, DoT is what merit parties have always been all about spike dmg is nice but not necessary, can chain high just as easy if not more easily with a couple wars and a monk, maintaining chains > slaughterfest that runs out of mobs.

As far as war/sam, i actually enjoy that to an extent, just because it's playing a different sub with tons of JA's I find i still like maneater/joyeuse quite a bit though, too bad with all the 2hander hype, no bard will sing madrigal to compensate for 1handers on birds anymore... I will though if i pick up a 1hander

[Tykkaru]

I don't join any merit PT unless there's one voker in it. WAR/NIN or NIN/WAR.

I could care less how long their polearm is and how much damage they do against birds.

[Rikkitikkitavi]

I really think it's forum ego problems. If you get into a good party, it's almost certainly with people who read KI or BG. I know a lot of people who refuse to merit without a Bard or, more often, two Bards or a Bard and Corsair, who refuse to sub anything other than Warrior (if Samurai) or Samurai, and who don't invite a one-handed weapon user anymore. It's all wank because the notion of efficiency and cooperation gets tossed out the window when worrying about putting out the biggest Penta Thrust or Tachi: Gekko.

That quite frankly is the only reason I merit anymore lol.

Once you hit 500 merits for 10 jobs, you really just get bored meriting, so it's just fun to see huge numbers lol.

Granted I will have brd 75 soon ( and i have a 75 brd mule already)and I may get annoyed with all sam parties, but until then... it keeps exp interesting.

[Zeto1]

I don't join any merit PT unless there's one voker in it. WAR/NIN or NIN/WAR.

I could care less how long their polearm is and how much damage they do against birds.

Hooray for BRDs being able to get their way in merit PTs because they're BRDs...

[pathwriter]

Last merit party I was in on Monk, the Bard said, "Sub whatever you want, I don't like being pushy." I subbed Ninja, because my desire for merits is bigger than my need for affirmation, and we did quite well. I wish I'd remembered her name.

[Rikkitikkitavi]

Hooray for BRDs being able to get their way in merit PTs because they're BRDs...

Brds rule the world, duh. Thats why im leveling it! (57 atm!)

[stubbieunicornserver]

Last merit party I was in on Monk, the Bard said, "Sub whatever you want, I don't like being pushy." I subbed Ninja, because my desire for merits is bigger than my need for affirmation, and we did quite well. I wish I'd remembered her name.

Yah, i always tried to justify mnk/war'ing in merits i.e. "hey you have this ridill war here so i should sub war!"

But in the end it became clear.. everytime that mnk/war is just too much.. lol

[Tykkaru]

Hooray for BRDs being able to get their way in merit PTs because they're BRDs...

I put it in my comment, if they don't comply to that I disband, simple as that.
It's just another step above "rep no thanks".

[Mauddib_Vivre]

I'll start off by saying that I have not played consistently in roughly 16 months, i've played but nothing more than log in and craft or perhaps do a random LS event, nothing heavily time consuming like exp'ing, Lately I've found myself having much more free time and seeking merits on my jobs, usually i start off seeking on monk for like eternity and when no invites i'll switch up to bard...

Every merit group I have joined recently has consisted of somehthing like RDM BRD DRG/SAM DRG/SAM SAM/WAR SAM/NIN or something very similar with SAM and DRG being mainly the only jobs i see.

Do you other bards actually like this? I find it to be a headache and a half, the last time i exp'd much people still invited jobs like MNK/NIN and WAR/NIN to merits for DoT value. These recent parties of mine I have found myself completely out of mobs to pull at birds, even if no other parties camp, trying desperately to pull off 2 songs before a mob dies, not always successfully, and then having to seek for repops to pull, breaking chains simply due to complete overkill dmg.

I recall pulling 100+ chains and singing to be so much easier in single bard setups involving wars and mnks and perhaps throw in one SAM or DRG, I'm not saying i don't think SAM and DRG are viable jobs for bird camps but - is it really necessary to have the party consist solely of them? Or is it more detrimental to exp?

I don't even want to get into other problems i've had with party setups consisted purely of these 2 jobs but i will anyway, Lack of provoke is seriously disturbing when you pull mobs and they run off after you as your seeking your next target making it two mobs on you rather than just 1 being pulled.Or also when the mage has to cure a melee at the start of a fight - its just too much like the doons

To me i think a party should be well balanced between spike dmg and DoT, if these people want that much spike dmg they better have a 2nd bard from now on to help with the mage set of songs or i will refuse is all i can say.

I'm not looking to start any arguments or flame wars here, i just want to know other bards opinions regarding WTF i should do here, i actually enjoy partying as bard, but i cannot stand the stress of overkill parties which i am seeing more and more of, these fuckers clear the entire zone in 5 minutes then cry they dont get 100+ chains

That's why Allah invited Minstrel ring + Yigit body / Shair Manteel. You sing one sing, pull, sing one song, pull sing another, rinse and repeat until your eyes about to fall out of your head. Don't PT without another brd or cor and DNC main healing > any mage job if you're doing birds. BRDs who can't keep up with PT's should delete their toons.

[Deo2]

Yeah, I kinda miss the weapon camps in Moon and Sky areas.

---

There are also the mamools that you had to invis past to get to the bird camp. You can pull 1 or 3 of them if you're running low on colibris.

If things get hectic, just run over the pond to mask your scent and lose aggro from the chasing mamools. Then you can sleep one and let the rest depop.

---

I find playing different music while playing bard to be very good. Especially since all my song macros have gear-swaps that cut off the flute music (although too much flute could be bad too... doot dootie doot~ dootie dootdoot dooo~).

[stubbieunicornserver]

That's why Allah invited Minstrel ring + Yigit body / Shair Manteel. You sing one sing, pull, sing one song, pull sing another, rinse and repeat until your eyes about to fall out of your head. Don't PT without another brd or cor and DNC main healing > any mage job if you're doing birds. BRDs who can't keep up with PT's should delete their toons.

I really didn't want to respond to this since as i stated im not looking for any kind of flame war here, but your comment would have been just fine without that last snotty line of it. You dont need to be a jackoff to get a point across, or do you? It really honestly wouldn't phase me if my toon got deleted or something anyway, this game is a massive waste of time and a fucking joke, because of people with shit attitudes like yours. People who think that it would seriously hurt them to offer a legitimate suggestion without being rude or snotty about it. I've already accomplished everything in this game i wanted to anyway, people like you make me think that maybe coming back to ffxi after this last break of mine was a bad idea, this game is so codependant on other people yet you strive to piss others off, it's illogical and i hope you don't treat people like that IRL.

What about when the zone is entirely clear including any available pulls from the other camp, yes it happens. The problem isnt that i cant pull mobs buddy so your -cast time suggestion is rather unhelpful and yes i do have -cast gears.

As I already stated i don't like to party without 2 bards, but again I end up seeking much longer, sometimes indefinitely if i have 2xBRD only comment, My RL doesnt allow for me to sit and play this game for 12hrs at a time.

[Mauddib_Vivre]

I really didn't want to respond to this since as i stated im not looking for any kind of flame war here, but your comment would have been just fine without that last snotty line of it. You dont need to be a jackoff to get a point across, or do you? It really honestly wouldn't phase me if my toon got deleted or something anyway, this game is a massive waste of time and a fucking joke, because of people with shit attitudes like yours. People who think that it would seriously hurt them to offer a legitimate suggestion without being rude or snotty about it. I've already accomplished everything in this game i wanted to anyway, people like you make me think that maybe coming back to ffxi after this last break of mine was a bad idea, this game is so codependant on other people yet you strive to piss others off, it's illogical and i hope you don't treat people like that IRL.

What about when the zone is entirely clear including any available pulls from the other camp, yes it happens. The problem isnt that i cant pull mobs buddy so your -cast time suggestion is rather unhelpful and yes i do have -cast gears.

As I already stated i don't like to party without 2 bards, but again I end up seeking much longer, sometimes indefinitely if i have 2xBRD only comment, My RL doesnt allow for me to sit and play this game for 12hrs at a time.

I was implying that if you're not equipped to handle BRD pulling in meripos, then stop using the job. If anything I said hit home, then suck it up. BRD's flying to boards complaining about pulling is so last season. Enough BIRD WHISTLE brd's populate.

[stubbieunicornserver]

Did you even read my original post or just quote it and spew out completely unrelated bullshit in hopes of starting an argument? It's got nothing to do with me not liking pulling.

I wasn't at all complaining about pulling in merit parties, that's expected, duh.

I was complaining about retarded people making parties that are dysfunctional, that has absolutely nothing to do with pulling. Does it? Just because I mentioned pulling as being one of the things adversely affected by these ridiculous party setups, thats only one example.

I dont care to further elaborate on this since you obviously have the same english comprehension as a mosquito.

[xurion]

I dont care to further elaborate on this since you obviously have the same english comprehension as a mosquito.

Totally sig'd.

[Zeto1]

I dont care to further elaborate on this since you obviously have the same english comprehension as a mosquito.

Woah woah woah Lets not insult the mosquitos.

[Mauddib_Vivre]

Did you even read my original post or just quote it and spew out completely unrelated bullshit in hopes of starting an argument? It's got nothing to do with me not liking pulling.

I wasn't at all complaining about pulling in merit parties, that's expected, duh.

I was complaining about retarded people making parties that are dysfunctional, that has absolutely nothing to do with pulling. Does it? Just because I mentioned pulling as being one of the things adversely affected by these ridiculous party setups, thats only one example.

I dont care to further elaborate on this since you obviously have the same english comprehension as a mosquito.

I stopped reading after the first sentences. DRG, SAM/DRG, WAR/SAM are whats in season at the moment. If they kill to fast and you can't keep up with the mobs, then disband or "dc".