[Maggote]

After dnc was released and I got back from a break I saw dnc and I was ZOMG what a nice job, so did a party like tank, DDx3, dncx2 (healers) was a fucking fail (lvl48-49 on garlaige citadel underground). After that I was a little meh, but is k, can be a nice job if u play good but like any others jobs 70% of ppl are fails.

[Banggugyangu]

After dnc was released and I got back from a break I saw dnc and I was ZOMG what a nice job, so did a party like tank, DDx3, dncx2 (healers) was a fucking fail (lvl48-49 on garlaige citadel underground). After that I was a little meh, but is k, can be a nice job if u play good but like any others jobs 70% of ppl are fails.

15-50ish, 2-3DNCs + random DDs = 10-20k/hr easy. I did this all the way up to 60. Got 60 exactly 6 days after DNC was released.

[Maggote]

So I got some noobs dnc that u probably saw cuz we're on ragna, one was one galka that he used all his way to 75 h2h.

[Archain]

I won't say that DNC is bad, I've actually seen some really freaking brutal ones lately as people start nailing down their merit direction. Those meritable abilities are awesome to be honest.

I personally do think that THF would have the upper hand in a merit party and on HNMs though. The gear available to THF really sets it apart despite DNC's awesome meritable abilities.

SA and TA are usually underestimated in just how much power they can provide to a WS. Weaponskills aren't the main gauge though, even with this parse below you can see that the WS/DoT split is still around 40% WS DMG and 60% DoT (43.5% WS:56.5% DoT). My straight DoT is overcome by the MNK/WAR, but THF DoT is usually fairly underestimated.



THFs are able to gear multiple subjobs for a damage dealing role on HNMs as well. DNC can use multiple subjobs too, including THF, if they wanted; the SA and TA effects aren't nearly as pronounced as the THF main.

Soldier's Drinks and "effect" steals (like JoL Boost) can really charge up a THF WS as well. If you use the "Boost in a bottle" that is the Soldier's Drink before a SATA powered WS, you can ensure that the tank merely standing to take damage at the start of an engagement, has the enemy's full and undivided attention immediately.



Yvora Boost steal



This works with regular WS in something like Limbus as well.



Higher end HNMs



Maat



Dagger selection is very good for an upper end THF and includes Mandau, which can use the 3x Base DMG proc internal to SA.





Even with the new WS and gear that is nearly achieveable by most you're able to hurt some of the higher stuff.







As a THF, I am unable to remove crippling status effects, heal others, or choose the DD/Tanking merit path that a DNC can. I DO believe that a DNC can become a very underestimated DD and if Augmented gear continues to follow it may really start to close an equipment gap that currently separates the two by a large margin.

[Deo2]

Bored at Work:

THF -no subjob
Tarutaru Lv75 Str48 Dex70 Vit53 Agi70 Int75 Mnd41 Chr44
Dagger Skill: 269 capped A-

DNC -no subjob
Tarutaru Lv75 Str48 Dex61 Vit50 Agi70 Int62 Mnd45 Chr65
Dagger Skill: 256 capped B+

Used the same race; ignoring Job Abilities, Merits, Weapon Skills used and Subjobs; a Thf has a basic lead of 13 attack and 13 accuracy from increased combat skill and a critical hit rate worth 9Dex on regular attacks.

[MattelotLeviathan]

This thread seems to be only dmg on colibris or what?
A lot of thf are retarded and maybe u are saying that dnc > thf because u only played with that hahathf. I know one that he preffer do merits on THF over his MNK because he can say SATA Dancing edge for 1k on G.colibris. Very, VEEERY sad.

I remember a thread where Blms were bragging about their damage on slimes.

In that case I'd take a WHM or RDM over a DNC, since they need TP to function. And if it's a high DEF mob well the DNC is SoL

We have a great Dnc in our LS who never has TP problems. There are mages who do have MP problems, so it depends.

Yawn. Since these other DNCs that apparently agree with you aren't forthcoming with their evidence, I'd say the people posting here are correct in their assumptions. Your entire argument, and I use the term loosely since all you seem capable of doing is replying with nonsensical drivel, seems to be based around the idea that somebody once told you that DNC was a better DD than THF.

Actually, if you re-read, you'll notice that I never said Dnc was a better DD than a Thf. Someone asked if Dnc could possibly out-damage a Thf and I said yes, because they can and i've seen it.

My previous example of an unstacked WS was a fluke was it?

Hold on, let me find a SS of a Thf who hit low on a WS and pretend like that helps my side so I can be cool like you.

Not in a million years will DNC be able to match a good THF. Until your DNC friends provide some support (and some figures) that prove me wrong, you've lost.

Translation: QQ

I enjoy how people think dnc is a DD and only place em in party for mele purpose. DNC is a front line healer and can main heal an entire party. people need to learn to stop obsessing with haste

That's what Dnc was designed for, but some have found other uses. Just like how War was designed to be main tank, Sam and Nin were designed to be backup tanks and Nin main tank a lot and i've not seen a Sam tank for 5 years. Thinking outside the box is cool

[Prothescar]

NIN was never meant to be a tank, btw. Your facts are now all forfeit to the might Thor.

[MattelotLeviathan]

Strange, SE even stated at the start that Nin was designed to be a DD and backup tank but didn't change it after they noticed people were using it for a main tank because they liked the direction people went with it.

[Banggugyangu]

Strange, SE even stated at the start that Nin was designed to be a DD and backup tank but didn't change it after they noticed people were using it for a main tank because they liked the direction people went with it.

Actually... no. SE announced when zilart was about to be released that NIN would be similar to RDM. The main difference between them is that RDM is restricted by MP while NIN is only restricted by the player's pocket book. At the time, there wasn't even Refresh for a RDM which further ephasizes that the jobs were quite similar. Players quickly realized how effective Utsusemi was at mitigating damage and capitalized on that.

Your statement than saying you never said DNC would always out DD THF but it "can" is a grade-school manipulation of words ignoring common sense. That's like someone asking if it's faster to walk from California to Texas or fly and you respond with "It can be, if you decide to fly to England first and spend a month there before heading to Texas."

[MattelotLeviathan]

Actually... no. SE announced when zilart was about to be released that NIN would be similar to RDM. The main difference between them is that RDM is restricted by MP while NIN is only restricted by the player's pocket book. At the time, there wasn't even Refresh for a RDM which further ephasizes that the jobs were quite similar. Players quickly realized how effective Utsusemi was at mitigating damage and capitalized on that.

Actually... yes. Sorry bub, I was there

Your statement than saying you never said DNC would always out DD THF but it "can" is a grade-school manipulation of words ignoring common sense. That's like someone asking if it's faster to walk from California to Texas or fly and you respond with "It can be, if you decide to fly to England first and spend a month there before heading to Texas."

lol cute. I guess the OP whizzed past you.

[Banggugyangu]

Actually... yes. Sorry bub, I was there



lol cute. I guess the OP whizzed past you.

Don't BS when the someone you're talking to can call you on it.

Secondly... allow me to throw a small variable into the OP's question: Can any DNC ever out DD Bang's THF? Not unless Bang is unconscious.

Comparing a good DNC to a failTHF is a moot point. *Btw... to the person who said "mute point"... it's "moot point"* If you're going to compare any two jobs, you have to compare them in a fair manner. Using semantics to make yourself sound witty is about as mature as taking a crap in your pants because you've not been potty trained. The OP wasn't asking if a DNC could out-DD a THF in an absurd situation that is horribly skewed in the DNC's favor. In that kind of mind-set, it's possible for a level 1 DNC to out-DD a level 75 THF. The OP was asking if a well-geared well-played DNC could out-DD a comparable THF. The answer is "No."

[MattelotLeviathan]

Don't BS when the someone you're talking to can call you on it.

No BS involved. Sorry, bro

Secondly... allow me to throw a small variable into the OP's question: Can any DNC ever out DD Bang's THF? Not unless Bang is unconscious.

Wow, you can toot your horn. Congrats

Comparing a good DNC to a failTHF is a moot point. *Btw... to the person who said "mute point"... it's "moot point"* If you're going to compare any two jobs, you have to compare them in a fair manner. Using semantics to make yourself sound witty is about as mature as taking a crap in your pants because you've not been potty trained. The OP wasn't asking if a DNC could out-DD a THF in an absurd situation that is horribly skewed in the DNC's favor. In that kind of mind-set, it's possible for a level 1 DNC to out-DD a level 75 THF. The OP was asking if a well-geared well-played DNC could out-DD a comparable THF. The answer is "No."

Another QQ post from a whiny Thf who doesn't wanna think that a Dnc can ever out-damage him.

The OP asked if a Dnc could out-damage a Thf. The simple answer is yes, it's possible. Is it the norm? Of course not, but there are some very brutal Dncs out there who have proved that they can keep up with some of the best.

You flat-out saying "no!" not only makes you sound more ignorant than I originally pinned you for, but i'm on the verge of actually feeling sorry for you. You sound like some total baddie.

Just because some Thf has good gear, doesn't mean he's great. I've seen a ton of bad Thfs who have really good gear and they think that makes them "good," and a bunch of actual good ones. Same goes with Dnc and every other job, so your flawed/prejudice statements are utterly rubbish.

Dancer is still rather new and i'm sure we're bound to see one who will do things that others thought was impossible just like others have with about every job in this game (besides Drk).

[MattelotLeviathan]

As a THF, I am unable to remove crippling status effects, heal others, or choose the DD/Tanking merit path that a DNC can. I DO believe that a DNC can become a very underestimated DD and if Augmented gear continues to follow it may really start to close an equipment gap that currently separates the two by a large margin.

Missed this and well said from a Thf.

[Banggugyangu]

Allow me to ask you a question which you will be unable to dodge with childish semantics.

Can a well-geared, well-played DNC doing everything in his power to deal as much damage as possible out-DD a well-geared, well-played THF also doing everything in his power to deal as much damage as possible?

Question to the mods: Is idiocy a ban-able offense? IMO, it should be punishable by death in real life. I understand that this is merely a childish attempt at trolling, and most likely done because said poster is starved of attention at home, but I would be much satisfied to see punishment brought to the stupid.

[treelo]

EVERYTHING YOU GUYS ARE SAYING IS WRONG BECAUSE YOU DISAGREE WITH ME. APART FROM ARCHAIN DESPITE ONCE AGAIN PROVING THAT DNC CAN'T DO MORE DMG THAN THF, YOU SAID SOMETHING I FIND ACCEPTABLE SO YOU MUST BE RIGHT.

Funny how the one thing he said that you agreed on, has nothing at all to do with the OP you keep telling us we're forgetting.

[MattelotLeviathan]

Allow me to ask you a question which you will be unable to dodge with childish semantics.

Can a well-geared, well-played DNC doing everything in his power to deal as much damage as possible out-DD a well-geared, well-played THF also doing everything in his power to deal as much damage as possible?

I'm sure it's possible. Unlike you, i'm a Thf who is willing to think outside the box. Your mind is focused on the norm.

Question to the mods: Is idiocy a ban-able offense? IMO, it should be punishable by death in real life. I understand that this is merely a childish attempt at trolling, and most likely done because said poster is starved of attention at home, but I would be much satisfied to see punishment brought to the stupid.

I wouldn't want it to be ban-able because I wouldn't wanna see you go.

I like tater tots!

I guess that's what the cool kids in your school are doing these days.

[BaliCupid]

Matt, you realize you're being trolled, right?

[MattelotLeviathan]

Matt, you realize you're being trolled, right?

eh, either way, it's entertaining seeing people cry when they think there is a possibility of something new doing better in any situation.