[Kiyara]

I do all 3 bite me.

[Corrderio]

Quote

End Game Tier List (again no particular order and just my opinion and not a fact):

S Tier : Pld, Blm, Rdm, Whm, Brd, Sam, Smn, Drk (KC zerg setup)

A Tier : War, Nin, Cor, Sch, Drk (normal setup)

B Tier : Mnk, Blu, Rng

C Tier : Drg, Thf

D Tier : Bst, Pup, Dnc


Soloing Ability Tier List :

S Tier : Rdm (sorry to say this but this is a fact no questions asked)

A Tier : Blm, Bst, Nin, Dnc, Smn, Blu, Thf

B Tier : Pld, Pup, Drg, Whm, Sam, Drk, Mnk, Sch

C Tier : Cor, Rng, War

D Tier : Brd


Party Tier List Normal Mobs and Overall Average :

S Tier : Nin, Whm, Rdm, Brd, Sam

A Tier : Pld, Blm, Cor, War, Drk, Sch, Mnk

B Tier : Rng, Smn, Dnc, Blu, Drg, Thf

C Tier : Pup

D Tier : Bst

Bloded = Fucking ROFL

[Tikki]

I actually know a brd who is pretty decent at solo. Nothing huge, like you won't see them taking on Despot any time soon, but Sebazy is pretty decent at solo.

[Corrderio]

Depends on the level really. I don't have any proof of it, but my friend says their mythic WS is a real killer.

[rambus]

.Sotek., on 13 November 2009 - 11:15 PM, said:

Erase =/= nas. Erasega is a completely different matter. I'll still only ever use that to drop bind, however. Otherwise people seem to think it's a good idea to spread out as much as possible when I start casting.



Did I say it has no use? When I said MV in my original post I was referring to stacking it 8 times.

erase is a na, nas rid status effects so does erase.

@ bold, your just being imposable to talk too.

.Sotek., on 12 November 2009 - 03:40 PM, said:

I can't help but laugh at anyone who thinks MV was ever worth a shit. Heck, calling it the best DoT ability is a joke in itself. You sir, are a moron.
SE already fixed SCH, that update infact pushed it from being a very gimp RDM to being better than BLM and WHM.

[rambus]

Kiyara, on 14 November 2009 - 01:23 AM, said:

End Game Tier List (again no particular order and just my opinion and not a fact):

S Tier : Pld, Blm, Rdm, Whm, Brd, Sam, Smn, Drk (KC zerg setup), COR, SCH

A Tier : War, Nin, Drk (normal setup)

B Tier : Mnk, Blu, Rng

C Tier : Drg, Thf

D Tier : Bst, Pup, Dnc
^ i am not sure what to do with thf or drg because they are wanted, just may not be wanted in huge amounts ( they will put a S demand for the job if the LS has none)

Soloing Ability Tier List :

S Tier : Rdm (sorry to say this but this is a fact no questions asked)

A Tier : Blm, Bst, Nin, Dnc, Smn, Blu, Thf

B Tier : Pld, Pup, Drg, Whm, Sam, Drk, Mnk, Sch

C Tier : Cor, Rng, War

D Tier : Brd

^ this for NMs or exp? SCH and BLM solo the same way just about so im confused why to rank them different. I ask this because some jobs that solo NMs well are ranked as high as jobs that solo exp well just weird list i do not know what to do with it.

Party Tier List Normal Mobs and Overall Average :

S Tier : Nin, Whm, Rdm, Brd, Sam pld, cor

A Tier : War, rng, Sch, Mnk , drg , thf

B Tier : drk, Smn, Blu

C Tier : Pup, dnc

D Tier : Bst,

E Tair: BLM
one healer, it goes RDM > WHM > SCH >SMN> DNC
want 2 supports, BRD, COR > BRD,BRD
something that is ok to sub war for voke
NIN, PLD ( if merits PLD is reped with WAR)
the other 2 slots is some DD, useally people look for SAM >DRG > WAR >THF

on asura PLD was so fucking high demand it shocked me for exp

And I say again just my opinion.

BLM only party in small groups on pets or BLM pts, I do not count these for being "wanted" its called I am making a setup because im a reject kind of like SMN and bst pts.

most drks make me want to kill something, its A, they being fucking scythe or some other stupid weapon pre 60, b. be a MP sink, c do other stupid things.

I had a drk that almost killed my self on SMN and my alt PL for being such a fuck up for souleating WS right when it was pulled.

I had 32085792937428274322 drks in east ron not using GA
I had 32085792937428274322 drks in east ron that almost kill them selfs on SE WS because the mob is not dead after a crappy ws and getting beaten on from the SE hate

I had a drk/thf in merits that would store 300 tp and use abs spells and crap for E-peen spinning slash then rest mp and told us we could not pull, joy for 3k / hr at 75

DRK is one of my most hated jobs just because how people play it, only reason i hate pup was how SE made the job, how they sound and look, and how the "moves" look the same thing as mob 2 hr.

I always give thf a chance its a good job in the right hands.

useally i liek to look for DD members in this order
SAM > DRG> WAR> MNK > RNG > THF >DRK > BLU > PUP

I will only invite a BLM if i absuolty need too. this means looking for a level sync and im getting crappy exp for 5 people ( like tuffing it out as a 42 in east ron or w/e). I will wait and exp as 5 people if the exp is decent then invite a BLM. I would not even be this hesitant in inviting a BST for a level sync. this is why BLM is class E for PT invites, i try avoid them at all costs even as a level sync, i would take a bst over them.

oh blu is anther one go all mp gear and af for 80% of the population.

[legen-unicorn]

As far as talking about what most failed jobs are in a party, think back to last time you made one, you checked all seeking for the level range/sync. Now which jobs did you notice seeking that could have filled the roll you needed but you waited to see if something better would pop. Those are the failed jobs, smn, sch, whm, thf, bst, pup, dnc, and after lvl 55 blm. This is for pty situations mind you, but when you see these jobs seeking and you need a DD slot of healer slot filled you are gona hold off to see if you can get a drk, drg, sam, war, mnk, or even blu hell i bet most of you will even after you waited 10 mins for a job to pop go through your ls's and friends lists to get one of those jobs. The even sadder part of all this is i'v seen ppl who main jobs like thf or whm, who flame ppl on forums like these whom talk poorly of their jobs, do this exact thing when lvling another one of their jobs cuz deep down they know they dont cut it as well.

In endgame alot of it depends on shell size, bigger shells will have more use for some jobs that smaller ones wont, but as far as essentials go, you need blms, rdms, whms, sams, plds, brds, cors, thfs (TH only). After you have those then you can get into rngs, drks, wars, smns, drgs, mnks, schs, blus, nins. And maybe if you have some outside alliance ppl to spare you will "allow" someone to come pup, dnc, bst, DDthfs, blus needing spells, and jobs under 75.

and for solo, if you can do it then its all you. Dont know why there is a pissing contest for solo, show ss of what you'v done and thats it, soloing only benefits you, not others so you can take w/e you think you can kill a mob with and do it. Level rdm tho if you want a solid all around solo job.

This isnt putting some jobs down, this is fact. Start a party, or become leader of a shell and you will see that everything im saying is correct. Not breaking down by "my so and so, or my bro's so and so is awesome", it is a blind breakdown by what jobs ppl see lfp or a list a leader sees of what you have and tries to make the "in theory" best group.

[treelo]

Thanks for perfectly proving my point about personal preference overshadowing non-biased opinions Rambus. I also find it highly amusing you'd invite a RNG over a DRK or THF. When mobs are dropping in 1-2 weaponskills, your RNG will be taking multiple mobs to get enough TP for Shitwinder, unless they're meleeing. If they're meleeing, they better have a Ridill or K.Club.

As for the whole THF is for TH only mentality, I had a rather brief discussion about TH2-4 the other day. Every linkshell will have at least one THF, same with DRG. The issue with TH is, you don't even know if it's working or not, and when you get full drops from something, you automatically assume that TH had something to do with it. The fact is, the effects of any TH are so marginal (especially 2-3) that they could effectively do nothing and you'd never notice. Consider how many things SE inadvertantly breaks during an update, now think about if they broke TH. You'd never know. I'd hardly call a job capable of matching every other DD that is assured a place in any alliance based on a single job trait broken. In fact, I'd chuckle most heartily if SE announced as they took the servers down for the last day that TH never did anything, it was just to get people to invite what they saw as an inferior DD.

The only jobs that can truly be considered failures, are those that have no place in endgame situations. Or at the very least, are not used by the majority of the community for such things. Almost every MMO is about it's endgame content, if your job has no purpose here, you can consider it effectively useless. THF and DRG (though it pains me to admit it) have their place in alliances, others like DNC, PUP, BST, etc, do not.

[rambus]

treelo, on 14 November 2009 - 06:07 PM, said:

Thanks for perfectly proving my point about personal preference overshadowing non-biased opinions Rambus. I also find it highly amusing you'd invite a RNG over a DRK or THF. When mobs are dropping in 1-2 weaponskills, your RNG will be taking multiple mobs to get enough TP for Shitwinder, unless they're meleeing. If they're meleeing, they better have a Ridill or K.Club.

As for the whole THF is for TH only mentality, I had a rather brief discussion about TH2-4 the other day. Every linkshell will have at least one THF, same with DRG. The issue with TH is, you don't even know if it's working or not, and when you get full drops from something, you automatically assume that TH had something to do with it. The fact is, the effects of any TH are so marginal (especially 2-3) that they could effectively do nothing and you'd never notice. Consider how many things SE inadvertantly breaks during an update, now think about if they broke TH. You'd never know. I'd hardly call a job capable of matching every other DD that is assured a place in any alliance based on a single job trait broken. In fact, I'd chuckle most heartily if SE announced as they took the servers down for the last day that TH never did anything, it was just to get people to invite what they saw as an inferior DD.

The only jobs that can truly be considered failures, are those that have no place in endgame situations. Or at the very least, are not used by the majority of the community for such things. Almost every MMO is about it's endgame content, if your job has no purpose here, you can consider it effectively useless. THF and DRG (though it pains me to admit it) have their place in alliances, others like DNC, PUP, BST, etc, do not.

yeah i know and i was not talking about merits only, im not sure what i looked last time for merits but i dont trust thf as much lower levels. people like giving a thf a hard time ( hate bouncing) and rng tends to move the mob too much and likei was explaining i rather deal with that then potentially getting a retarded drk. also keep in mind what i said about merits in that persons quote fix

Quote

one healer, it goes RDM > WHM > SCH >SMN> DNC
want 2 supports, BRD, COR > BRD,BRD
something that is ok to sub war for voke
NIN, PLD ( if merits PLD is reped with WAR)
the other 2 slots is some DD, useally people look for SAM >DRG > WAR >THF

[Creelo]

Tikki, on 14 November 2009 - 05:10 AM, said:

I actually know a brd who is pretty decent at solo. Nothing huge, like you won't see them taking on Despot any time soon, but Sebazy is pretty decent at solo.

I definitely agree with this, well I mean to say that Brd's can solo pretty decently. A lot of people think Brd can't solo worth a shit, but in actuality, they generally aren't too bad lol

We can get shit tons of Haste through just gear and March x2, which makes /nin quite effective (ESPECIALLY combined with Carnage Elegy)

We can perform decent WS dmg through good gear; Mordant Rime truly is a great WS for Brd. <3

Also, Brd/whm is actually a great job combo for simply out-lasting mobs as well, since the Brd can just stack on a ton of Phy. Dmg -% Gear to greatly lessen dmg, and then combine that with just Paeon x2, a Regen, and /whm's Auto Regen (could also include Regen gear like Orochi's Nodowa if wanted). Cure III/Status cures if need be, and just Spirit Taker for MP. Takes forever to kill the mob lol, but the Brd will generally win, even on many T mobs.

Essentially, I think a lot of people forget Brd's have Carnage Elegy, which makes such a huge difference when soloing. And if shit does hit the fan, we can usually just Lullaby -> {Run Away!} I'm not saying a Brd can solo nearly as well as most other jobs, but they definitely not as helpless as they're usually perceived to be. (Technically, anything that can be Lullabied, could be solod by Brd. This can be said for all jobs that can sleep the mob they're soloing, but is especially true for Brd's since Lullaby requires 0 MP and is mostly only inhibited by it's terribly short duration)

Edit: Ooooooh yeah lol, I forgot to mention Virelai. lol Before I quit FFXI, I used to sometimes fart around in Gustav Tunnel as Brd/whm and fight the Doom Warlocks in the futile hope of getting a Blizzaga III Scroll by using Virelai on Pugils along with sometimes engaging the Warlock too. Mekki + Pugil can really hurt those skellies lol Funny thing is, I actually managed to get a Blizzaga III scroll on one of my solo trips there lol...

Finally, I wish I could've tried out Brd/bst before quitting the game, but I never had the time to get Bst up to a decent enough lvl to make it worthwhile Wouldn't be able to Charm mobs for nearly as long as a good Bst, but Carnage Elegy would probably help a ton with the Pet's survivability. (But no SS or Blink would truly suck >.< Would have to Depend on Paeon x2/Regen Gear and Phy. Dmg -% Gear most likely for your own survival ) Although, a Brd could just Lullaby the mob/s if need be too I guess... Provided there's no DoT.

[Nath]

I dont know to take the ranking post seriously or if its just a damn good troll

[Azarall]

Jesus. Can't believe such an obvious troll-bait thread got so many bites.

First off, just because I point out a painful truth in the community hardly makes me a tool OR a troll. The arguement was THF's ability to transfer hate and do damage, my arguement was that SAM (Or yes, even DRK) can do the exact same thing with /THF, AND do more damage with a higher rate of TP gain (Meditate, Absorb-TP) in between WS. I mean... seriously. Are people arguing that this is WRONG? I'm not saying "ONLY" play as SAM. If I believed that I sure as hell wouldn't have taken DRG to 75, now would I? I'm stating that SAM tends to do better in general. A well played/geared DRG can put out some nice digits but SAMs require half the work other melee jobs require to do the same job.

And Treelo, just as you defend THF and swear up and down that it's useful and that you do so much better than a good majority of the community's other THFs (maybe I'm exaggerating on that assumption), but you realize that other jobs like DNC, BST, and PUP that you just labeled useless will swear the same thing. Just saying, it's all a matter of personal opinion. I think multiple THFs for any event is pointless. You may not.

These posts where RNGs are gimped confuse me. I've almost always seen Rangers near the top of any damage parse.

I have to argue with BLMs being top tier /EXP/ jobs. Pre-54 we all love them but past 54 unless you're synching or you're a BRD, RDM, or COR, you won't likely be grouping with one.

And SCH... they are in NO WAY a replacement for a merited WHM or a merited BLM. They're versatile, they have uses that WHM and BLM don't have, but they are NOT a replacement. That is where many mages get butt-sore is people saying "Oh well we can invite a SCH/RDM we don't need this WHM/SCH with full Cure Potency and Healing Magic merits, or this BLM with full enfeebling/elemental magic merits and ice/thunder accuracy. See?

kthxbai

[Griss]

that's what happens when a bait thread gets derailed into an actual conversation lol

[Tamashii]

[Corrderio]

Tamashii, on 17 November 2009 - 01:23 AM, said:

Sad fact this is true, but meh... what nation doesn't have their own problem?

[fyreus]

Azarall, on 12 November 2009 - 03:06 PM, said:

Not just exp mentallity. A THF deals spike damage and transfers hate. A SAM/THF can do the exact same thing with more damage, and more survivability. Again, the sole advantage is TH4.

You missed the point when stating this (we're talking HNM context here) so anyone inviting a SAM/THF endgame over TH4 (isn't the reason you fight hnms are for items?) is stuck in EXP mode--something that shouldn't be part of HNM party setup.

"As for THF... personal experience has shown that I've never needed one with a PLD tank around, or as a PLD tank myself, and any job with THF sub can spike damage and shed hate just as well, with faster tp gain and higher damage in between WS."

To paraphrase: 'I don't need a THF because I hold hate and they don't do enough damage SO I might as well get a SAM/THF'

See the EXP mentality here? THF is able to save your behind (Yes, a paladin.) in an instant while sam can't. The other thing is this: /THF is for spike damage, so why not get a DRG/WAR and probably get better overall damage?


"
And Treelo, just as you defend THF and swear up and down that it's useful and that you do so much better than a good majority of the community's other THFs (maybe I'm exaggerating on that assumption), but you realize that other jobs like DNC, BST, and PUP that you just labeled useless will swear the same thing. Just saying, it's all a matter of personal opinion. I think multiple THFs for any event is pointless. You may not."

Find a DNC OR BST OR PUP that says that. You may not know this... but WE know you're just tossing things out there for the hell of it. The only job that comes close to alost saying that would be a BST in a solo party or PUP in a sucky sucky group of RMT in the mire. Don't feel like you're being soloed by everyone here or being pointed out, but if you come to these forums with a bit of personal sight then we WILL show you the big picture. Posts here are generally aimed at helping to correct rumors and problems with this community in an informing way. People may or may not notice this, but it's very true and we'd rather have an educated bunch running around teaching those behind us than an uneducated bunch bringing our gaming community back down to 2004 (heck, no one would get a party).

Just take some time and look into these jobs and see what they can do and leave personal experience with said jobs at the door until then.


*Edit* Why the hell do i keep reading Treelo's post? The OWN/PWN in there is so dramatic because i know EXACTLY what they're talking about with a DD THF who knows how to gear up. Gonna go watch a real action movie now.

[Velhart]

Azarall, on 16 November 2009 - 07:01 PM, said:

And Treelo, just as you defend THF and swear up and down that it's useful and that you do so much better than a good majority of the community's other THFs (maybe I'm exaggerating on that assumption), but you realize that other jobs like DNC, BST, and PUP that you just labeled useless will swear the same thing. Just saying, it's all a matter of personal opinion. I think multiple THFs for any event is pointless. You may not.

Thieves are useless? When did this happen? Thieves that are in my LS have a pretty good time keeping up with our other DD's in end game. Can say good gear is required to deal great damage on a Thief, but is this not the case on all classes?

[Corrderio]

If more THFs were like Treelo's no one would doubt a THF's damage potential.

[fyreus]

^

[Sotose]

I think it is just a matter that bad players more frequently gravitate to certain jobs. I mean there are imbalances in the game, and SE should be more proactive in fixing them but still things aren't THAT bad.