[Kleiner]

with the inevitable end of FFXI coming in, at the soonest, a year, i figured it was time to get off my ass and something i've been aching to do for a long time: finish my WHM melee build. I'm mapped out pretty much everything i'll be wearing for TP and WS in a general situation, and want to see if iv'e missed anything.

For the record, i don;t care about your opinions on WHM melee, whether you like it or not, and whether you think it will work or not. i simply want to make sure i have targeted the optimal gear.


TP

Perdu Wand - 5 ACC - 14 ATT
Morgenstern - 6% Crit
Walahra turban- 5% Haste
Goliard saoi - 4% Haste
Blessed Mitts - 5% Haste
blessed Pants - 3% Haste
Blessed Shoes - 2% Haste
Ulthalam ring - 4 ACC - 4 ATT
Raja's Ring - 5 DEX - 5 STR
Swift Belt - 3 ACC - 3% Haste - -5 ATT
Brutal Earring- Double Attack
Merman Earring- 5 ATT
Chival. Chain - 5 ACC - 3 STR
Tiphia Sting - ACC+2 - ATT+2
Bellicose Mantle- ATT+6

TOTAL
Haste- 21%
ACC- 18.5
ATT- 22
Double attack
DEX- 5
STR- 8




WS
Perdu Wand - 5 ACC - 14 ATT
Morgenstern - 6% Crit
Healer's Mitts+1 - 7 STR - 7 MND
Tabin Jupon - 1 STR - 1 DEX - 5 ACC
Optical Hate - 10 ACC
Minuet Earring - 1 DEX - 1 STR
Tiphia Sting - ACC+2 - ATT+2
Ulthalam ring - 4 ACC - 4 ATT
Raja's Ring - 5 DEX - 5 STR
Life belt - 10 ACC (until i can afford Potent Belt)
Brutal Earring - Double Attack
Merman Earring - 5 ATT
Chival. Chain - 5 ACC - 3 STR
Tabin Bracers. +1- ACC+3 ATT+3
Prince's Slops - ACC+4 MND+3
Bellicose Mantle- ATT+6


TOTAL
Double attack
Crit- +6%
ACC- +46.5
STR- +14
MND- +10
DEX- +7
ATT- +34


The only thing i don't have is the San d'Orian CP mantle, STR+2 MND+2, but i don't know hwo soon i'll be getting that. i'm roughly 10k CP short of getting it, and who the hell exps in the old world anymore aside from new jobs, and i have no intention of leveling a new job any time soon.

If i'm missing nay gear or need something that better fits a certain spot, feel free to critique.

[pathwriter]

First question that comes to mind is where do you intend to use it? Even with sushi, you're giving up so much Accuracy (e.g., Goliard Saio instead of Reverend Mail or Royal Redingote) that I'd worry about you maintaining a decent hit rate on merit mobs, much less harder enemies.

Also, what exactly is your definition of "optimal"? If we're talking White Mage/Ninja, I'm pretty sure that "optimal" means Mjollnir and Kraken Club. And then there's the issue of Blessed +1. Chivalrous Chain doesn't impress me.

So little Attack and STR, especially if you are eating sushi, means that your Hexa Strikes aren't going to be terrifically impressive. I'm not sure that can be overcome, though, since there's so little Attack gear for White Mage, period.

[Kleiner]

Pushing up hexa isn't hard, even without much ATT. and for using it, i mainly mean using it for fun; i doubt my Ls idoing to let me bring it out to endgame events. this is mainly for me to use for m own enjoyment.

I don't have a PCC because the shit's 2 mil and i'm generally not rolling in gil. i'm 0/32 on BCNM as well, which doesn't help. Blessed+1 is out of the question, that's just as expensive, and much more rare.

As for accuracy, i won't have an issue meleeing most merit mobso utside of THF/NIN mamools in that haste; We do afterall have a good natural club skill, and it's fully merited for me (I have no intentions of leveling another melee based job, i have no reason NOT to have it merited).

I have my Rev Mail, and if ACC is an issue i can easily swap into it for TPing, but using it for WS is out of the question. As for Royal Redingote, making a -real- WHM hauby would be excellent, but the bonuses to PUP from Mirke Waldecors aren't outweighed by a moderately better TP and WS body for my toy WHM build.

[lorzy]

i believe you tp in 23% haste. blessed hands/legs/feet are 10, saio is 4, turban 5, and swift is 4.

[Kaparu]

First question that comes to mind is where do you intend to use it? Even with sushi, you're giving up so much Accuracy (e.g., Goliard Saio instead of Reverend Mail or Royal Redingote) that I'd worry about you maintaining a decent hit rate on merit mobs, much less harder enemies.

Also, what exactly is your definition of "optimal"? If we're talking White Mage/Ninja, I'm pretty sure that "optimal" means Mjollnir and Kraken Club. And then there's the issue of Blessed +1. Chivalrous Chain doesn't impress me.

So little Attack and STR, especially if you are eating sushi, means that your Hexa Strikes aren't going to be terrifically impressive. I'm not sure that can be overcome, though, since there's so little Attack gear for White Mage, period.

If he's using it for messing around, he can probably work with meat, and if he's using it for meriting, he won't be using Hexa Strike.

[pathwriter]

Why do you say that? If he was seriously meriting, he wouldn't need the MP return from Mystic Boon every time he has TP and, speaking from experience, True Strike never compares to Hexa Strike.

[Pergatory]

Those Tabin Bracers are pretty bad, but I noticed you listed Healer's Mitts +1 too. Use the Healer+1 for WS, get rid of Tabin Bracers. Also, just so you're aware, the crit rate enhancement on Morgenstern will only work on the Morg itself. It won't work on your Perdu swings, nor will it work on your WS unless it's mainhanded (in which case you'd lose the Perdu latent on your WS). For that reason I think Purgatory Mace or Deae Gratia might be a better offhand choice.

First question that comes to mind is where do you intend to use it? Even with sushi, you're giving up so much Accuracy (e.g., Goliard Saio instead of Reverend Mail or Royal Redingote) that I'd worry about you maintaining a decent hit rate on merit mobs, much less harder enemies.

Afflatus Misery + Auspice goes a long way toward covering WHM's accuracy problems. I tried TPing in Goliard Saio & Reverend Mail at merit camps, and my accuracy ended up being about the same. I don't parse though, so I can't say for certain I was capped acc in the Saio. I can say, though, that I was very close, with my only accuracy coming from Perdu Wand, Chiv Chain, Blood Ring, Jaeger Ring, and Swift Belt. I don't even use Tiphia, I use White Tathlum. I do eat Sushi religiously on WHM/NIN though.

Why do you say that? If he was seriously meriting, he wouldn't need the MP return from Mystic Boon every time he has TP and, speaking from experience, True Strike never compares to Hexa Strike.

Say what now? This is as far from the mark as you can get from my own experiences. I've only done a handful of real (read: over 20k/hr) merit parties on WHM/NIN, and in every single one I'm lucky to be able to do one Hexa every 30 minutes. That's with Perdu/KC, 25% haste on equipment, and darn near capped accuracy. I'm literally dropping Boons every 40 seconds or so to keep up with my MP usage. I suppose if you invited a second healer then you could spam Hexa all you want, but then you're not really a Whinja, you're just a gimp DD. If you're seriously talking about WHM melee in a merit party, they should still be the only healer and should be keeping buffs up on the whole party. If they're doing that, they're going to need a lot of Boons to sustain it.

That being said, I hope the OP's Mystic Boon set is not the same as their Hexa set. It requires a totally different build, mainly focused on attack & MND.

[pathwriter]

Ok, let me back up. I don't expect someone who is meleeing to support the party significantly. I've had merit parties with a Blue Mage as healer and merit parties with a Blue Mage as DD and I wouldn't expect a Blue Mage to cover both roles at the same time. If a White Mage wants to melee in a merit party, and I'm absolutely certain that he could if he wanted, I would want him doing damage while someone in the backline is handling Cures and Haste and shit.

[Kaparu]

I'm a very strong advocate of WHM melee, but only because of the MP-efficiency edge it has to offer with Mystic Boon. I could give two shits about how much damage the person is doing.

[Requim]

Prudence wand is a good off hand weapon. I think perdu/prudence is the best combo pre-relic/KC.

Diabolos earring might beat merman on harder things or just to maintain higher haste.

Definitely keep an eye on your accuracy, but last I saw haste was worth full timing even if your accuracy sucks. Reverend mail is neat, though tabin jupon +1 is basically the same thing.

Also depending on your end game friends you could work for gnadbhod's Helm for WS (since it's also good for pup among other jobs!) Voyager sallet would be an update if you were fighting weaker things (which it sounds like you would be and acc should cap easily). Depending on your acc you might even want to use AF hat or goliard for ws.

Remember the only 3 WS you're really using are all str/mnd modifiers so when your acc is capped (which it sounded like you were just going to go for easy stuffs) aim to amp up WS.

[Kleiner]

Those Tabin Bracers are pretty bad, but I noticed you listed Healer's Mitts +1 too.

Not sure why the tabin bracers are listed; was an oversight on my part. Healer's Mitts+1 all the way for WS.

Reverend mail is neat, though tabin jupon +1 is basically the same thing.

Rev Mail's -5 MND on WS makes me very hesitent to use it for WSing, but if ACC is truly an issue, i'll use it for TPing.

Prudence wand is a good off hand weapon. I think perdu/prudence is the best combo pre-relic/KC.

I'm working on my Prudence rod, actually. farming the pops so my LS will get it for me.

Why do you say that? If he was seriously meriting, he wouldn't need the MP return from Mystic Boon every time he has TP and, speaking from experience, True Strike never compares to Hexa Strike.

alot of this setup is to try the WHM/NIN main support line of work. I'm really tired of standing back in a merit-po and just haste cycling and Regen cycling; with this i can melee, Mystic Boon my galka head off, and never rest, while also contributing to the chain while healing and hasting.

However, I DO intent to attempt focusing purely on DD at least once or twice, to check it out. Even in WHM gear, i can pull off some decent Hexas, and i want t osee what i can do o na squishy bird when i really work.

Also, just so you're aware, the crit rate enhancement on Morgenstern will only work on the Morg itself. It won't work on your Perdu swings, nor will it work on your WS unless it's mainhanded (in which case you'd lose the Perdu latent on your WS).

I know that Morg only affects mainhand swings and only affects the WS if mainhanded, however i did not know that Perdu's ACC and ATT bonus would not apply to the WS if offhanded. That's good information. It also is a bit more fuel to the fire to work o na Dae Gratia; however i think Purg mace is just far too slow.




As for my Boon set, i'm still building it. (almost) everything listed so far i have obtained, other than Goli Saoi. I'm working on my Mystic boon set now, which, like you said, is much more ATT and MND focused.

[Shirai]

WS
Perdu Wand - 5 ACC - 14 ATT
Morgenstern - 6% Crit
Healer's Mitts+1 - 7 STR - 7 MND
Tabin Jupon - 1 STR - 1 DEX - 5 ACC
Optical Hate - 10 ACC
Minuet Earring - 1 DEX - 1 STR
Tiphia Sting - ACC+2 - ATT+2
Ulthalam ring - 4 ACC - 4 ATT
Raja's Ring - 5 DEX - 5 STR
Life belt - 10 ACC (until i can afford Potent Belt)
Brutal Earring - Double Attack
Merman Earring - 5 ATT
Chival. Chain - 5 ACC - 3 STR
Tabin Bracers. +1- ACC+3 ATT+3
Prince's Slops - ACC+4 MND+3
Bellicose Mantle- ATT+6

My WS set:
Head: Voyager Sallet; +3 STR +4 DEX
Neck: Flame Gorget
Body: Reverend Mail (Redingote is used for summoner augments and the accuracy makes up for the other slots I put STR gear in)
Hands: Healer's +1; +7 STR +7 MND
Waist: Jungle Sash; +4 STR -4 MND
Legs: Blessed trousers; +6 MND (Kinda to make up for the MND lost with the Sash and reverend mail.)
Feet: Savage gaiters; +3 STR
Rings: Ruby Rings; 2x +4 STR (Replacing with flame if I ever get the gil for it)
Back: Shadow Mantle (I have it, and only use melee whm for solo so why not? But I guess I'll look into Belliscose.)
Earrings: Suppa/Brutal

STR +24 (+27 if I use Purgatory mace)
ACC +10
WS ACC +10

As for TP body it depends on mob evasion.
Mail on high evasion and Nashira Manteel on lower evasion.
I don't have the Goliard body yet and besides I still think it looks repulsive >_>

[Fredjan]

This is my setup when I melee for fun on WHM (excluding weapons):

Ammo: Tiphia Sting (this stays on all the time)
Head: Walahra Turban
Neck: Peacock Charm
Earrings: Merman's + Brutal (no Suppa)
Body: Goliard Saio
Hands: Blessed Mitts +1
Rings: 2x Sniper's
Back: Bellicose Mantle
Waist: Swift Belt
Legs: Blessed Trousers +1
Feet: Blessed Pumps +1

Hexa Strike (Black Halo gear is almost identical, except MND rings, different gorget, and Blessed Trousers +1 and Cleric's Duckbills +1):
Head: Healer's Cap +1
Neck: Flame Gorget
Earrings: Merman's + Brutal
Body: Royal Redingote (Acc/Atk+10 augments)
Hands: Healer's Mitts +1
Rings: Triumph x2
Back: Aslan Cape
Waist: Potent Belt
Legs: Prince's Slops
Feet: Goliard Clogs (DEX+MND combo is my reasoning)

Mystic Boon:
Head: Healer's Cap +1
Neck: Peacock Charm (no SC properties)
Earrings: Merman's + Brutal
Body: Royal Redingote (Acc/Atk+10 augments)
Hands: Healer's Mitts +1
Rings: Aqua Ring + Tamas
Back: Bellicose Mantle
Waist: Potent Belt
Legs: Blessed Trousers +1
Feet: Cleric's Duckbills +1

[Banggugyangu]

Kleiner, you've got a great start for sure. My 2 cents:

1: If you're using morgenstern in your combo, main hand it. If you have mjollnir, throw away your morg. Extra 1 DMG and 6% crit rate on HS will outdo the acc/attack from perdu.

2: Keeping auspice up full-time will dump you at capped accuracy for all things applicable after 1-2 mobs. Keeping this in mind, it's a good practice to use accuracy gear with meat early on and then when your accuracy has boosted to near-cap, dump that accuracy gear for haste and attack. With capped accuracy, there's no reason whatsoever to use accuracy gear even in WSs so boost attack/mods for WS at that point.

3: Attack is <3. For all single handed melee jobs this will be a constant. If you can boost your attack a little more without dropping below 80% acc, then do so. You'll understand why when you do it.


Regarding being main healer in meripo while meleeing: Very possible. Requires a LOT of attention, however. Most people tend to focus on nothing but their own weapon as it collides with the mob when they engage something. This is why most people frown on WHMs meleeing period. If you can keep your focus, then there's nothing to worry about. If not, then get another healer and go DD mode.

When main healing a meripo, boons will be priority as stated above. With the right gear, there will be some amazing returns from boon, enough so that if there's a BRD, it'd be more beneficial to receive march and minuet than any ballads.

KEEP AUSPICE AND MISERY UP FULL TIME AND EAT MEAT!!!!!!! If it doesn't drop, neither will your acc. This is the single largest boost WHM has ever received for meleeing ability on anything that matters. Take advantage of it and then rub it in someone's face. *kinda joking but yeah*

My personal favorite healing combo for meripo is DNC and WHM. A good DNC will put out almost as much damage as a decent WHM. *A great DNC can almost match a good WHM*. When the healing is shared between these 2 jobs, there's almost no danger whatsoever for the entire party. This combo will add enough damage together to make up for whatever anyone might think they lack in damage alone. Haste samba + haste + march has an amazing effect on a group of /NIN melee's. I encourage any WHM interested to try this out. It's a ton of fun and very effective. I myself have had a meripo raking in 28k/hr with WHM, DNC, BRD, DRGx2, SAM. I had another one pulling 30k/hr swapping 1 DRG for a COR. Both of these PTs were extremely impressed with WHM's potential output while still maintaining all buffs and party safety.

Final note: KC is a toy. I don't recommend it's use for anything other than goofing off. If you're doing something that matters, then you'll benefit more from a REAL club than that fun piece of garbage. *For meripo, your TP isn't necessarily more important than the DRGs that just got stolen*

[Kleiner]

: If you're using morgenstern in your combo, main hand it. If you have mjollnir, throw away your morg. Extra 1 DMG and 6% crit rate on HS will outdo the acc/attack from perdu.

Oh definately. I wouldn't think of not mainhanding morg.

I'm a little surprised to hear that Perdu's latent bonuses won't apply to the WS when offhanded, but it makes sense. I'm trying to decide now if the ACC/ATT is worth keeping for TPing, or if i should try to get a better club for offhand.

[Banggugyangu]

Oh definately. I wouldn't think of not mainhanding morg.

I'm a little surprised to hear that Perdu's latent bonuses won't apply to the WS when offhanded, but it makes sense. I'm trying to decide now if the ACC/ATT is worth keeping for TPing, or if i should try to get a better club for offhand.

I've personally never heard this regarding any of the weapons with this hidden effect. Unless something has been recently discovered, it's common knowledge that blau dolch is part of EVERY combination of daggers for a THF whether it's your best for main hand or not. The reasoning behind this is the hidden effect is too potent for both TPing and WSing. Acc and Attack function fundamentally differently than crit rate, not to mention that the crit rate on morg style weapons is something that's unlocked for that weapon.

Has anyone tested whether or not a weapon with simply "Crit hit rate + X%" under all normal circumstances will effect both hands? It's fact that any weapon with acc + or attack + under normal circumstances will effect both hands during both TP and WS. If a weapon that's natively Crit hit rate +x% doesn't effect both hands, then it's plausible that perdu weapons will have their effect for both hands.

[Gyth]

2: Keeping auspice up full-time will dump you at capped accuracy for all things applicable after 1-2 mobs.
3: Attack is <3. For all single handed melee jobs this will be a constant.

With this capped acc thing, is staff worth thinking about, or are the WSs too lol?

/sam Mekki Shakki retributions, /thf SA martial staff full swing?

[Banggugyangu]

With this capped acc thing, is staff worth thinking about, or are the WSs too lol?

/sam Mekki Shakki retributions, /thf SA martial staff full swing?

staff weapon skills really are pretty garbage. Sticking with club is the best bet.

[Fredjan]

Staff is a joke. Nothing is more frustrating than missing the WS at 300% TP.
...Which I've seen more often than I'd like.

The only reason I leveled Staff skill was for Spirit Taker, and with Mystic Boon available, that's a joke.

Not to mention WHM has better club skill.

[Pergatory]

Final note: KC is a toy. I don't recommend it's use for anything other than goofing off. If you're doing something that matters, then you'll benefit more from a REAL club than that fun piece of garbage. *For meripo, your TP isn't necessarily more important than the DRGs that just got stolen*

I absolutely 100% disagree with this statement. KC is an extremely powerful tool for WHM, and not just for goofing off. I've applied it in several merit parties for over 30k/hr as the sole healer. In one of the two parties, I even told all the melees to /SAM or /WAR to really test the full viability of melee WHM in the main heal role. The only people in that party with Utsusemi were me and the BRD, I was spamming cures like crazy and there's no way I could've kept my MP up without a KC. I'm not sure what your last sentence in asterisks is really implying, either. The increase in TP moves from the enemy is more than matched by the increase in MP gain for the WHM, so the extra healing is not an issue.

In fact I've even used KC in rougher situations than that. I've just about solo'd Roc twice using KC to sustain MP. The first time I had a SAM69 with me, but every time he pulled hate he'd nearly die as I spam Cure IV's trying to get hate back, so he spent most of his time facing away from the mob. (My enmity-30 didn't help.) We got it to around 15% after Bene, then it raged. Second attempt was with a BRD75 who didn't have melee gear, so he pretty much stood there and sang songs while I solo'd Roc. That time I got it down to 1% after Bene, then it raged >_<; Got so close that time, it pissed me off. Still, with any other offhand aside from KC it would not have been possible to get anywhere near that close.

I've personally never heard this regarding any of the weapons with this hidden effect. Unless something has been recently discovered, it's common knowledge that blau dolch is part of EVERY combination of daggers for a THF whether it's your best for main hand or not. The reasoning behind this is the hidden effect is too potent for both TPing and WSing. Acc and Attack function fundamentally differently than crit rate, not to mention that the crit rate on morg style weapons is something that's unlocked for that weapon.

I could be wrong on this then, but I was fairly certain it was the case. In light of folks' surprise at this though, my confidence is lowered... probably best not to choose whether to use Perdu or not based on my testimony then hehe, sorry if this turns out to be misinformation.