[Henchman]

Identifying yourself to the police will not result in the downfall of mankind/democracy/civilisation as we know it.

ya I kinda side with treelo.not that big of a deal,since im sure none of us LIKE dealing with cops (I damn sure dont)
do that will make em go away,if u get hostile yull jus make shit worse.in my eyes???not worth it.

[pathwriter]

What will you guys do when you find out that your kid is being picked on by the school bully and having his lunch money stolen every day (do people still carry daily lunch money? let's just pretend)? Sure, your little Timmy will get away from the bully faster by just giving him the dollar and running, but it doesn't stop the bastard from demanding it again tomorrow.

You guys seem to keep thinking in terms of a single incident. If it was a single, isolated, once-in-a-lifetime incident that Officer Shithead demands to see someone's ID for being the wrong color in the wrong neighborhood, I would be faster to agree with your assessments. Sure, it makes sense to avoid being in a position that a cop can harass you in the first place, but that doesn't justify allowing him to do it when it happens. If you're ok with flashing your ID on command, that's your prerogative. Give me your lunch money while you're at it, you're too skinny and small and self-hating to need to eat today, anyhow.

[treelo]

What will you guys do when you find out that your kid is being picked on by the school bully and having his lunch money stolen every day (do people still carry daily lunch money? let's just pretend)? Sure, your little Timmy will get away from the bully faster by just giving him the dollar and running, but it doesn't stop the bastard from demanding it again tomorrow.

You guys seem to keep thinking in terms of a single incident. If it was a single, isolated, once-in-a-lifetime incident that Officer Shithead demands to see someone's ID for being the wrong color in the wrong neighborhood, I would be faster to agree with your assessments. Sure, it makes sense to avoid being in a position that a cop can harass you in the first place, but that doesn't justify allowing him to do it when it happens. If you're ok with flashing your ID on command, that's your prerogative. Give me your lunch money while you're at it, you're too skinny and small and self-hating to need to eat today, anyhow.

I have no issues with beating up a child, I'd teach the punk a lesson he'd never forget.

As for treating it as a single incident, that's not true. Every police officer who stopped me could ask to see some ID and I'd most likely do it without hesitation, not because I'm scared, or because they might take me downtown if I don't, but because it's a simple enough thing to do and saves us both a lot of time. If a criminal tried to rob me, you can bet your ass I'd resist, the two things are completely unrelated. While their request might not be legal, showing them your ID doesn't deprive you of anything, if it's illegal for them to ask to see some ID, sounds like a stupid law to me. That doesn't mean I think they should change the law so you are forced to. Making the situation completely neutral legally seems like the best option, you still have a choice in the matter.

[Henchman]

What will you guys do when you find out that your kid is being picked on by the school bully and having his lunch money stolen every day (do people still carry daily lunch money? let's just pretend)? Sure, your little Timmy will get away from the bully faster by just giving him the dollar and running, but it doesn't stop the bastard from demanding it again tomorrow.

You guys seem to keep thinking in terms of a single incident. If it was a single, isolated, once-in-a-lifetime incident that Officer Shithead demands to see someone's ID for being the wrong color in the wrong neighborhood, I would be faster to agree with your assessments. Sure, it makes sense to avoid being in a position that a cop can harass you in the first place, but that doesn't justify allowing him to do it when it happens. If you're ok with flashing your ID on command, that's your prerogative. Give me your lunch money while you're at it, you're too skinny and small and self-hating to need to eat today, anyhow.

to me u cant compare the 2.that kid takin ur money will harass and degrade you everyday.showing ID to law enforcement
is hardly degrading but I guess can be construed as harassment...but either way,they wont bother u every day
like the bully most likely will if u give into him even once.I see wat ur tryna say with ur example,jus think it was a lil
extreme compared to the current issue being discussed.

[pathwriter]

And I understand that, Treelo, but complying with a questionable demand emboldens the officer to make further such demands. Maybe he won't make them of you, but once he gets used to having people do what he says regardless of legality, the habit can only escalate. This is not news, either, it's largely at the heart of the corruption of every person who has ever been guilty of corruption. Bernard Madoff didn't wake up one morning and decide to scam people, he did it by steps and stages testing just how far he could push. Hell, without the recession, I'm not entirely convinced he would have ever been found out, because the SEC should have caught him at least 6 years ago.

What I'd want to see the law be is that an officer can ask for and expect to see identification only in the process of arresting someone for a crime. If I'm walking around the ghetto for whatever reason, that doesn't mean that I'm automatically subject to the whims of a racist cop who assumes that I'm either lost (because I'm white and in the ghetto) or buying drugs (because I'm white and in the ghetto). It may be highly probable that those would be the two reasons I am there, but this returns to the presumption of innocence. Until evidence shows that I'm committing a crime, I should not be treated as a criminal. The law doesn't even require witnesses and informants to identify themselves publicly (I'm unsure what police procedure is with regards to retaining their identities internally). You may think that your identity is worthless right now because you're a British chick in her 20s, but when you're pushing 50 and sitting on top of a slave empire forged from the remnants of Belgium, you may have a different attitude.



As for you, Henchman, just remember to thank the officer as he shoves his baton into your various orifices. Gotta be nice to the man of justice, after all.

[Henchman]

ok I see your perspective.its just being a minority scars.the various ppl that have been harassed by cops im sure DID
comply u know????rodney king prolly cooperated,not trying to say every cop looks for blacks they can beat up,but
why take the chance???it seems high risk no reward watsoever inna way.I know thats a twisted way to look at things but
im paranoid I may get arrested and detained 4 no reason or my ass beat cuz I was "resisting arrest".every cop doesnt operate
like that,but why get stopped,asked 4 ID tell em fuck off,the have shit escalate???not worth it to me.with both our point of views presented,seems catch 22ish to me now.

[pathwriter]

The issue is that it's not just about being a minority. I've had this kind of crap pulled with me for being male because my accuser was female. Do we prevent more cops like Crowley or these little 24-year-old punks by going along with it? The cops who tried to make me look like a murderer and a rapist were bleeding rent-a-cops employed by the university, so they're at the bottom of the food chain in terms of actual power but they're at the top of the list of people with an inflated sense of power and authority. Had I actually done anything that was insinuated against me, I'd have been speaking to real policemen downtown instead of listening to their accusations and telling them off for it. And they couldn't do shit when I told them what I thought of them, either. Gates's response of anger was a mask for fear. I get frightened by the police from time to time, but nothing short of a gun is going to make me back down. It seems to work, too, because I've yet to have a cop try to escalate things when it becomes clear that I know the limits of his authority.

[rambus]

This is exactly what I've been trying to say. There is no reward in trying to be a hard-ass and refuse to cooperate with the police just because you can.

we had a different thread with the same point! had to do something with a BS site about " flex your rights"

[Henchman]

lol wats funny is the fact that I thought about it a while,and realized I could be slightly biased because I
actually plan to be a cop....
idk how smart it is to post sumthin like this in FWs of all places but meh fuck it,as if my friends didnt flame
me enuff when they found out -.-

[firefeng]

idk how smart it is to post sumthin like this in FWs of all places but meh fuck it,as if my friends didnt flame
me enuff when they found out -.-

FW hates the police?

[Henchman]

maybe,maybe not firefeng,but in los angeles,CA (where I reside)
most dont hold cops up 2 high so id expect constant resistance...like I said my own
damn friends were like "wtf u sellout!!!!" my fam gave me shit 4 it jokin around but ya man
cops are the enemies around these parts...so.....sound off if u down with da cops!!!!!