[Sorai]

Ok, so I know nin has kinda died in merrit parties/some end game areas, but I have yet to see SE post anything
on vanafest's twitter about nin getting utsusemi: san, or anything close to that. I don't think nin was even mentioned? Is nin gonna be a dead job now..?

[Brayker]

Sorai, on 28 February 2010 - 06:01 PM, said:

Ok, so I know nin has kinda died in merrit parties/some end game areas, but I have yet to see SE post anything
on vanafest's twitter about nin getting utsusemi: san, or anything close to that. I don't think nin was even mentioned? Is nin gonna be a dead job now..?

They only mentioned job adjustments for 3 jobs, there are 20. I dont see the other 17 jobs crying "NO UPDATE MEENZ MAH JORB IZ DED!"

"Future Direction of All Jobs
The future direction of adjustments for all jobs beyond the March version update will be announced at a later date."

Calm the fuck down!

[Sorai]

lol just read the cap got raised to 99, so ya I think nin hopefully gets something worth continuing it to 99.

[Chocoburger]

Aggressor to counter the -ACC from Yonin. :x

[Sakka_Valefor]

Brayker, on 28 February 2010 - 06:11 PM, said:

They only mentioned job adjustments for 3 jobs, there are 20. I dont see the other 17 jobs crying "NO UPDATE MEENZ MAH JORB IZ DED!"

"Future Direction of All Jobs
The future direction of adjustments for all jobs beyond the March version update will be announced at a later date."

Calm the fuck down!

This. Jesus Christ.

[pathwriter]

They twittered ideas about almost every job except Ninja.

Who cares, though? Even if people still care, this is Square-Enix, they're not going to do this right or, if they do, they'll fix it within a week so that it is no longer fun.

[Nekozuko]

Chocoburger, on 28 February 2010 - 09:22 PM, said:

Aggressor to complement the +ACC from Innin. :x

Correction! Because Plds will be used for tanking . Meanwhile us Nins are just DD that people try build up to be tanks in xp so they think of us a Lol .

[Chocoburger]

Well hopefully they bring back the old-school utsusemi for NIN main, and have the tier of AOE magic take a specific number of shadows. This really should have been the case the entire time for NIN main. Makes sense since we are the masters of Ninjutsu and yet the only three differences between sub and main is, spell interruption (which means nothing for high level events since a NIN is almost always going to be interrupted during Ichi and often on Ni), one less shadow and recently NIN. Tool Expertise with Yonin. I don't feel like the master of Ninjutsu, and that needs fixing, pronto! Also Jubaku: Ni is a shoe-in for levels 76+. At least it better make it in!

[Deo2]

My ninja's only 50, but here's something I picked up in the SMN forums: Elmer's VanaFest Analysis

Quote

Ninja has secured its spot as a tank, but the developers are considering the need for an Ability that allows them to sharply increase Enmity, akin to Provoke. However, rather than a simple spike of hate, they want it to entail more collaboration with the party itself, so there is still more discussion to be had before the Ability takes shape. Another consideration is Ninjutsu one can employ as backup when suddenly stripped of their Utsusemi shadows. Regarding Utsusemi, they are considering having the icon display your remaining shadows.

Probably something like collaborator, but with ninjutsu. The utsu counter and backup-utsu sounds good.

[MrReinhardt]

utsu counter is best, the windower one is hit or miss

[Snprphnx]

Elmer actually translated all that was said, here ya go

Quote

Ninja has secured its spot as a tank, but the developers are considering the need for an Ability that allows them to sharply increase Enmity, akin to Provoke. However, rather than a simple spike of hate, they want it to entail more collaboration with the party itself, so there is still more discussion to be had before the Ability takes shape. Another consideration is Ninjutsu one can employ as backup when suddenly stripped of their Utsusemi shadows. Regarding Utsusemi, they are considering having the icon display your remaining shadows.

taken from
http://www.zam.com/s...tml?story=21769

[Sorai]

That sounds nice and all, but the main reason nin isn't used in end game has nothing to do with the shadow counts, it actually
has a lot to do with the fact higher lvled mobs tend to use AoE skills, and spam them on a regular basis, leaving the nin open to die.
Which is why paladins have replaced nin :/ I think SE needs to give nin a pld ability

[Oulanbator]

"Another consideration is Ninjutsu one can employ as backup when suddenly stripped of their Utsusemi shadows."

It seems to cover the problem you mentioned. Backup spell for when shadows are down. Could do a lot of things: PDT, MDT, extreme evasion/parry boost, super spell interruption boost, dread spikes effect... and more. (I'm not saying it will do everything, these are just possibilities )

This post has been edited by Oulanbator: 04 March 2010 - 03:55 AM

[Hakutaky]

Ninjas will replace DRG's.





















lol

[Mogar]

Ninja's have already been replaced.

[Snprphnx]

While nin has for the most part been overshadowed by pld over the past few years, it is still a perfectly viable option for almost all killable mobs. As others have shown previously, NIN can tank DI, Sandworm, Odin, sky, all sea NMs (AV don't count due to being unkillable atm), ToAU kings, etc.

With all these updates, I hope t see an uprising in NIN tanking as NIN/RDM, for we will hopefully be gaining access to convert, haste, refresh, cure iv (go go cure iv cheat macros), and MDB II.

[Chocoburger]

Why would a NIN want to convert? If you're at low HP you'll have like 100 MP to cure yourself... If you're at high HP and you want some MP (for whatever reason other than curing yourself) you'll end up with 15 HP and 180-300 MP and you'll have to use all that MP again just to cure yourself back to the halfway point.

[Oulanbator]

It's a mistake to think cure IV cheat macro is a good hate tool. Cure IV is a terrible hate tool, Plds use it because they have nothing better (well, besides atonement), and they need a lot of refresh gear and traits to sustain it reliably.
By the time Ninjas will get access to cure IV (at lv 96), Whms should have access to a cure VI, while Rdms, Plds and Schs will probably have an updated cure V (one that generate normal hate). Chances are cure IV will mostly be a backup healing tool for Nin/rdm, just like cure III is at the moment (handy in a couple situations but not worth using in your hate cycle).

Nin/rdm already have way better hate tools than self curing: a sleep > blind > dispel > blind rotation is really efficient.
The only new serious hate tool is Sleep II, which is a nice CE spell (will give more CE than a cure IV) but with a high Mp cost and recast time. It looks like a decent tool to rebuild hate fast after a big enmity loss/wipe, but that's it.

Refresh and Haste shouldn't be useful at all. Seriously, there should be a Whm or Rdm or Sch in your party able to buff you with these spells. Same applies to Pld or any other job.
Convert will be really gimp given Ninja have a terrible Mp pool. It's already a waste on a Pld/rdm with 1500 Hp/500Mp, and they probably won't use it as well.

Nin/rdm however brings in two nice tools: MDB II ( which is a +20% increase in MDB) and MAB II (same increase) for the Ninjas using Nukes as a hate tool.

I don't think any of these will make nin/rdm really different. Anyways, we have to see how the game evolves to define if Nin/rdm is going to be a useful tank or not. To be honest, I'd really love to have a WS that supports tanking efficiently by cheating the game (à la atonement), whether it's a WS that deals a lot of damage or generates a lot of enmity no matter the damage, in order to see the come back of Ninja melee tanks.

This post has been edited by Oulanbator: 09 March 2010 - 03:20 AM

[Kendo]

NIN/DNC is going to be able to solo just about all current stuff in the world.

[Mogar]

Any job can solo mostly everything at 99