[Jazz]

Greeber, on 04 April 2010 - 09:31 AM, said:

What about the Greatsword salamander, it can get 71 dmg and 456 delay vs the 78 base dmg and 508 delay of the vengence. Maybe with the lower delay it might be better for zerging?

The name of that GS is actually "salamand sword" last time I checked...

Also, its 41 dmg and 456 delay...but if you do the 226 trial for it, which is 10 Krabatoa Shells.... it gets DMG+30, OAT, AND Delay+24.

So the final weapon should be DMG 71, OAT, Delay 480 (and you need 30 StoreTP for 6hit with that 480 delay which pretty much requires /sam, rajas, brutal, rose strap, AND askar body or aurum body)

(I don't like the delay on the GS much...sure the GS has OAT on it; however, the Scythe for example has OAT but also because of its higher delay can still get 6-hit without having to make a sacrifice in the body slot or something like that.)

As for zerg, these new weapons can be good for something like a mini-zerg of sorts...if you don't have anything better for zerg.(Kclub being the best option of course...or OctaveClub if you do that.....or M.kris with good support, feint etc...)

Finally, Bahamut's Zaghnal is also 480 delay, but it is "Occasionally attacks two to three times." It should still win over the OAT GS and the OAT scythe for zerg.

[Serpent]

currently camping tiger NM for ultimatum..

how many have a finished one already? whats the damage like?

[firefeng]

Just got into my first merit party since coming back, at birds, and with a fully upgraded Ultimatum. Party itself was a wash; I was so drunk I'd brown out and come back and be sitting on 170 TP and shit, had BRD & COR but songs/rolls were Min/March/Rogue/Corsair (I tried having the COR use Chaos multiple times so BRD could double march, but he never did for some reason...), SAM only used Polearm part of the time for some reason, and god knows how many Meditates and Last Resorts I missed given how utterly wasted I was, but even still, I saw something pretty damn funny:

Melee Damage
Player            Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit%
DRG                    99282   47.42 %     618/51   92.38 %    87/258   146.02     65   216/393  285.09   10.52 %
COR                    61922   61.13 %    1407/84   94.37 %     13/66    39.81    139    55/118   82.34    9.88 %
Firefeng               70565   52.85 %     415/19   95.62 %   109/299   161.06     29   242/355  289.55    6.99 %
BRD                        0    0.00 %        0/1    0.00 %       0/0     0.00      0       0/0    0.00    0.00 %
SAM                     91219   52.00 %     834/79   91.35 %    42/182    98.76    105    87/345  183.10   12.59 %
Wyvern                 19678   64.60 %     469/56   89.33 %     31/68    40.67     15     64/96   81.07    3.20 %


Other Physical Damage  (Counterattacks and Retaliations)
Player            CA.Dmg  CA.Hit/Miss  CA.Low/Hi  CA.Avg   Ret.Dmg  Ret.Hit/Miss  Ret.Low/Hi  Ret.Avg
DRG                 3058         23/0    101/247  132.96         0           0/0         0/0     0.00
Firefeng            1121          7/0    114/238  160.14         0           0/0         0/0     0.00

Weaponskill Damage
Player                 WSkill Dmg   WSkill %  Hit/Miss   WS.Acc %   WS.Low/Hi   WS.Avg
DRG                         93570    44.69 %     116/0   100.00 %    165/1459   806.64
 - Penta Thrust             90926    97.17 %     112/0   100.00 %    165/1459   811.84
 - Wheeling Thrust           2644     2.83 %       4/0   100.00 %     523/755   661.00
COR                         39277    38.77 %      63/4    94.03 %     335/781   623.44
 - Detonator                 3504     8.92 %       8/0   100.00 %     335/522   438.00
 - Slug Shot                35773    91.08 %      55/4    93.22 %     550/781   650.42
Firefeng                    58840    44.07 %      79/0   100.00 %    165/1287   744.81
 - Cross Reaper              6436    10.94 %      12/0   100.00 %     165/988   536.33
 - Guillotine               52404    89.06 %      67/0   100.00 %    205/1287   782.15
SAM                         84218    48.00 %     109/3    97.32 %    313/1240   772.64
 - Penta Thrust              8906    10.57 %      14/0   100.00 %     313/980   636.14
 - Tachi: Gekko             67862    80.58 %      82/2    97.62 %    347/1240   827.59
 - Tachi: Kasha              5541     6.58 %       9/1    90.00 %    320/1102   615.67
 - Tachi: Yukikaze           1909     2.27 %       4/0   100.00 %     316/595   477.25

Take a look at the average melee/critical dmg between me and the DRG. DRG wasn't a nub, was using homam hands/legs/feet and askar body at the very least, and we were both using Coeurl subs, although I only had a stack, so that was gone before the party was even halfway through (most of the parse shown is without food, since SAM replaced another DRG halfway through--before I ran out of food, my AVG Guillo was higher than both of the DRG's avg pentas). Before the SAM joined, we had another DRG, and I was hitting harder than him, too, although he wasn't as competently equipped as the DRG shown. Also of note: Melee high was 299 for me, and I didn't use Souleater at all... So, Ultimatum > piercing bonus? Shit, I'm kicking myself for not upgrading the OAT scythe, still.

Even if I played like shit...I love my new scythe. Although since I have full Crit merits, I'm wondering why my critrate was only 7%...

This post has been edited by firefeng: 09 April 2010 - 11:02 AM

[Serpent]

hmm interesting... lets get some sober parses =P

[Torak]

sounds promising. i need one more god damned tiger before i move onto hotpot. also are the Vnm sea monk & doomed toad hard to kill? not looking forward to doing those.

[Saeunn]

I really wish i wasn't making the +acc and dex one. Ultimatum and the OAT one seem much better.
Although i still need 80 raptors in crappy weather

This post has been edited by Saeunn: 09 April 2010 - 05:42 PM

[Greeber]

Saeunn, on 09 April 2010 - 05:09 PM, said:

I really wish i wasn't making the +acc and dex one. Ultimatum and the OAT one seem much better.
Although i still need 80 raptors in crappy weather

Im about to give up on my dex/acc one...200 qutrub's arent easy to kill w/o a party. But w/o scythe merits and abyssal idk if the ultimatum or severence would be better. /Wrist SE for not raising merit cap T.T

This post has been edited by Greeber: 09 April 2010 - 08:46 PM

[Vawtwee]

Well, in response to the drunken parse above, lol


Your results are uh...okay at best. Comparing the drg in the parse to any drg who's actually decent isn't really fair to do, especially considering the lack of Drakesbane. This was my average drakes from the last merit I did, with only min and march, and no food.

Player                 WSkill Dmg   WSkill %  Hit/Miss   WS.Acc %   WS.Low/Hi   WS.Avg
Valtiel                     88137    55.86 %      79/0   100.00 %    384/1946  1115.66
 - Drakesbane               88137   100.00 %      79/0   100.00 %    384/1946  1115.66

Rogue's or Chaos roll will put my average up around 1300, sometimes higher.

I also know that I've parsed higher than your average guillotine using perdu, which is significantly less base damage, so I'm kinda wondering what the heck your gear setup was.

Ultimatum is definitely not better than piercing bonus, but I would like to see an ultimatum parse against the OAT scythe as far as a merit goes.

This post has been edited by Vawtwee: 10 April 2010 - 04:07 PM

[firefeng]

Vawtwee, on 10 April 2010 - 11:53 AM, said:

Well, in response to the drunken parse above, lol


Your results are uh...okay at best.

Don't mince words. Results are pathetic. I've averaged 1k Guillos at birds with Chaos/Min/Coeurl subs using Tredecim and Moliones, and average 800 damage Cross Reapers in those same situations but with no food and only one minuet, my Guillotines are only landing with about 550 atk. You're more than welcome to run out and test your Perdu's Guillotines with only 550 atk and see what comes of it.

I've also partied with DRGs who had average Pentas of over 1.1k, too, and I'm fully aware that Drakesbane is far more disgustingly awesome than either Guillo or Penta. I just found it funny that I was hitting harder than the DRGs despite shit gear and drunken playing.

This post has been edited by firefeng: 10 April 2010 - 07:45 PM

[Vawtwee]

Yes, because I would compare my fully buffed guillos to yours without taking into consideration chaos, min, and food.

I meant in the SAME conditions as yours, which is why I mentioned your gear. According to the last merit I did on drk, I had min/march, and no food, and my average was 841.12. My attack is 507 without buffs, so around 550 with min only.

My point is that I'm still looking to see the significance of Ultimatum over Perdu. I don't think I've ever seen my DRK lose to a DRG as far as average melee attacks go, or melee damage for that matter (aside from gungnir), so it's not really convincing for me. Honestly if you had parses with Moliones or Perdu I'd love to see them, just to compare them to the results you got with Ultimatum.

And of course it would help to re-parse ultimatum when you're sober, lol

[firefeng]

Also wouldn't hurt to have two separate Guillotine macros with varying degrees of ATT/ACC/STR, but I switched to spellcast when I came back and I've been putting it off until I get AMKD helm. Base attack with Guillotine is only 482, but it's got ACC overkill because I was planning for it to primarily be used at MMJSP until I got the helm and made two separate Guillo macros (the low ACC one primarily being used in situations where I'm getting Rogue's roll or madrigal for no reason in particular).

I'm curious what gear you're using for your WS macro. My Guillo macro looks like this:

Ultimatum
Sword Strap
Fire Bomblet
Optical Hat (Need AMKD helm, obviously, since I was never close to Ares/Heca for this slot)
PCC (MIssing Snow gorget, one yovra organ off)
Brutal earring
Abyssal earring
Hauberk +1
Chaos Gauntlets +1
Rajas
Woodsman
Forager's
Potent Belt (camping Virtuoso belt NM right now, actually Virtuoso Belt got)
Black Cuisses
Aurum Sabatons

Lacking Ares, Adaberk, and all the fun HNM drops that I do, my gear is pretty damn average, but it isn't gimp. I'm curious as to what your WS macro looks like that you can average 841 dmg on Guillotine with ~550 attack. I'm assuming you're using AMKD helm so you can stuff STR into other slots and inflate your fSTR, but I really am at a loss as to how you can average 100 DMG higher than me on Guillotine with ~15 more attack using a weapon with 12 less base damage.

This post has been edited by firefeng: 11 April 2010 - 06:51 AM

[Vawtwee]

Perdu/Pole
Fire Bomblet
Heca cap
Snow Gorget
Brutal/abyssal
Ebody
AF+1 hands
Triumph ring/Rajas
Forager's Mantle
Warwolf Belt
Ares's Flanchard
AF+1 feet

502 attack (without hasso)
+56 str
+4% DA
401 acc (without hasso)

If I can't fulltime hasso I just swap in potent belt. Also 5/5 LR potency merits, and I noticed you said you missed a lot of those, so that can have a decent influence over averages.

Edit: I swap gear in and out depending on the situation, obviously, the most notable one for merit being ares's cuirass with diabolic eye and hasso on.

This post has been edited by Vawtwee: 11 April 2010 - 05:14 PM

[firefeng]

Vawtwee, on 11 April 2010 - 05:05 PM, said:

Perdu/Pole
Fire Bomblet
Heca cap
Snow Gorget
Brutal/abyssal
Ebody
AF+1 hands
Triumph ring/Rajas
Forager's Mantle
Warwolf Belt
Ares's Flanchard
AF+1 feet

502 attack (without hasso)
+56 str
+4% DA
401 acc (without hasso)

If I can't fulltime hasso I just swap in potent belt. Also 5/5 LR potency merits, and I noticed you said you missed a lot of those, so that can have a decent influence over averages.

Edit: I swap gear in and out depending on the situation, obviously, the most notable one for merit being ares's cuirass with diabolic eye and hasso on.

Yeah, that makes more sense. (And my LR potency was only 3/5 as of that parse.) I'm just gonna chalk it up to the fact that I was way too drunk to be playing. Just got out of Omega, average Guillotines were 700 damage, even, using the gear posted before (except switch potent for Virtuoso Belt), with red curry bun being the food and having no rolls/songs. Average attack on Omega was ~600 for WS, yet I only parsed 41 damage less than what I did for flying pusbags--I have no idea how that happened, but I must have been far more drunk than I thought in that merit party. (Obviously only counting two leg form, I'm not dumb enough to feed omega TP when it's on four legs.) Had highest average WS damage over two RNGs' Sidewinders, which is weird to me without support buffs to beef up Guillo, but they weren't eating red curry and I wasn't paying attention to their subs, and the BLU's Cannonballs were kicking all of our asses in spike damage anyway.

It'd be nice if we got someone who isn't as poorly equipped as I am to test this shit out. I get the strong sense that I'm missing out on this scythe's full potential.

This post has been edited by firefeng: 11 April 2010 - 11:51 PM

[Vawtwee]

If I could ever finish yacumama and feuerunke I could test it out. Same with Vengeance, actually. just started my hippo trial.

[Elizabet]

I finished the hippo trial, but the 10 eyes of Verthandi will prove hard to obtain for me. I really need to work time for VNMs (and ppl to do it) in my schedule....

[Serpent]

just finished my ultimatum.. now to seek party ><

[Serpent]

finally got a merit party. DRK/SAM Nonchalant (me) WAR/SAM Mikeh (E.body/perdu voulge) WAR/NIN Wilder (Hauberk +1/Bonesplitter)

party at nyzul>bhaf birds bottom camp, clearing birds and wivres. brd and cor support (marchx2, chaos/corsair rolls)
me and war/sam were eating yellow curry buns. i don't remember what food the war/nin was using.





was a 35~40k exp/hr pt. Reached chain #240 and disbanded

My gear:
TP (WS)
Ultimatum/Sword strap
Fire bomblet
Ace's helm
Haubergeon +1
Justice torque
Homam hands (Chaos gauntlets +1)
Homam legs (Black cuisses)
Homam feet (Hecatomb leggings)
Swift belt (Potent belt)
Brutal earring
abyssal earring
rajas ring
ulthalam's ring (Flame ring)
forager's mantle

i love the scythe

This post has been edited by Serpent: 21 April 2010 - 06:41 PM

[Greeber]

dose anyone know a good camp for qutrub? the DC ones in Arrapago reef. i know a camp where 6 of them pop but with 2 ppl we can kill all 6 and have to wait 5-10 min for repops (think they have a 15 min respawn).

[Tomasello]

Comparing these two weapons based on ALL the stats (ie. Dmg, Delay, Bonuses, etc.)



AND



On paper the Severance is pulling ahead slighty in melee and Guillotine Damage...

Anyone else compare these two and obtain similar results?????

P.S. And they're both crushing Perdu.

[TigreDelNorte19]

Serpent, on 16 April 2010 - 07:48 AM, said:

finally got a merit party. DRK/SAM Nonchalant (me) WAR/SAM Mikeh (E.body/perdu voulge) WAR/NIN Wilder (Hauberk +1/Bonesplitter)

party at nyzul>bhaf birds bottom camp, clearing birds and wivres. brd and cor support (marchx2, chaos/corsair rolls)
me and war/sam were eating yellow curry buns. i don't remember what food the war/nin was using.

Spoiler

was a 35~40k exp/hr pt. Reached chain #240 and disbanded

My gear:
TP (WS)
Ultimatum/Sword strap
Fire bomblet
Ace's helm
Haubergeon +1
Justice torque
Homam hands (Chaos gauntlets +1)
Homam legs (Black cuisses)
Homam feet (Hecatomb leggings)
Swift belt (Potent belt)
Brutal earring
abyssal earring
rajas ring
ulthalam's ring (Flame ring)
forager's mantle

i love the scythe

Am I the only one that thinks that that COR should get slapped upside the head? lol@25% ranged accuracy with 3ranged attacks used....