[Sorai]

So have any pups tested their new h2h update to see if they can survive ballista now?
any summoners test out odin?

[Temadian]

I know some pups who did decent enough before the upgrade...

[rambus]

why only metchon (talk/say i dont know this spelling) odin?



this is better

[Aeonknight]

If you can't see how an instant gate breach by wiping out multiple people is more beneficial than protection around a fixed area is in terms of actually winning a fight, then I have serious doubts you've ever ballista'd before Rambus.

Odin is an insta-kill as always. but the catch is that they can't have him already out, ready to cut someone in half. In other words, they have to get in range and begin casting the avatar. Which leaves plenty of time to stun, silence, sleep, or just smack them around. Watch for invisible gankers.

PUP? I haven't fought one in years.

[rambus]

Aeonknight, on 30 March 2010 - 11:00 PM, said:

If you can't see how an instant gate breach by wiping out multiple people is more beneficial than protection around a fixed area is in terms of actually winning a fight, then I have serious doubts you've ever ballista'd before Rambus.

Odin is an insta-kill as always. but the catch is that they can't have him already out, ready to cut someone in half. In other words, they have to get in range and begin casting the avatar. Which leaves plenty of time to stun, silence, sleep, or just smack them around. Watch for invisible gankers.

PUP? I haven't fought one in years.

assuming or test?

sounds like lack of knowledge.



dought it will land on 2 people, want to guess it would be some gimp damage like :



that was like 300 damage and it missed the pet.

and i was just talking about the size of Alexander i missed the point of this thread at first yes, but you missed the point of my post too

ever account of range of it? so ya siding with lack of knowledge:



Alexander is most likey more useful since it has bigger range and the enfeebling magic protection makes it easy for team A gank the whole team B

maybe you are the one that needs to rethink tactics.

This post has been edited by rambus: 31 March 2010 - 08:03 AM

[PaladinAlik]

only jobs i ever had trouble pre update on pup were sam's and thfs. sams because theyd wait for voke to wear and then sekkanoki kill me. and sams were just really really hard to hit.

rdm's were easy enough to silence and kill on pup and same with blms.

Never fought a good bst tho.

I imagine a thf is easier to fight now for pup as pre update we needed a ton of acc just to hit at a decent rate, and a well geared thf was still near impossible to hit, itd still be hard but I can prob beat a thf much easier now

[Aeonknight]

Even in the event it only kills 1 person, getting an easy gate breach for 6 people total (and of course robbing that 1 person of scoring whatever they have saved up) is still going to be more beneficial to actually winning a match than giving people nearby near-invincibility for a minute and a half, provided they actually stay @ that location. About the only applicable use would be trying to defend a Rook, but it doesn't last forever... and scoring > not scoring.

Haven't had the chance to test odin on more than 1 person yet, but have seen it kill someone with the usual KO'd message. Either way it's use is pretty clear.

[rambus]

Aeonknight, on 31 March 2010 - 08:52 AM, said:

Even in the event it only kills 1 person, getting an easy gate breach for 6 people total (and of course robbing that 1 person of scoring whatever they have saved up) is still going to be more beneficial to actually winning a match than giving people nearby near-invincibility for a minute and a half, provided they actually stay @ that location. About the only applicable use would be trying to defend a Rook, but it doesn't last forever... and scoring > not scoring.

Haven't had the chance to test odin on more than 1 person yet, but have seen it kill someone with the usual KO'd message. Either way it's use is pretty clear.

who says it will kill them? could miss or just do damage

you assume too much.

that may put the smn in a bad spot to try it anyway. PD > go in gank someone and run away if you are really obssed with that, no one can be harmed or slept or w/e doing that.

giving the other team with a free GB (your way) is REALLY smart

This post has been edited by rambus: 31 March 2010 - 10:09 AM

[Aeonknight]

Do i really need to spell it out for you rumbas? You really can't connect the dots yourself? Obviously you don't want to play stupid as a SMN. but any real ballista SMN should have a playstyle that usually doesn't involve them getting killed anyway. This is just giving them something fun to work with.

First, missing? Haven't seen it happen yet. Damage? that seems to be only on NM's, where the instant death doesn't apply. Players aren't NM's.

Even if i'm largely overestimating Odin here, he's still a hell of a lot more useful than Alexander. Alexander's effect can be mimiced by a carnal incense and a catholican. You don't need near-immunity for a minute and a half unless you're defending a rook, or doin' it wrong.

[Cream Soda]

Odin took out 4 of my teammates. I lol'd so hard. I saw that horse and got the fuck out. Then 5 mins later they fall for the same shit (he had revit)

[rambus]

Cream Soda, on 01 April 2010 - 05:44 AM, said:

Odin took out 4 of my teammates. I lol'd so hard. I saw that horse and got the fuck out. Then 5 mins later they fall for the same shit (he had revit)

that's a first, something more effecitve in pvp then out on the field.

but ya has a bit of delay i guess it is runnable from, range is not big, i need to ask though did they stay in a "cone: formation or did it actually aoe?

Quote

Even if i'm largely overestimating Odin here, he's still a hell of a lot more useful than Alexander. Alexander's effect can be mimiced by a carnal incense and a catholican. You don't need near-immunity for a minute and a half unless you're defending a rook, or doin' it wrong.

cant use both, lest you cant in besieged.

it is really hard to someone to sleep/stun/ gravity/ bind a smn and one shoting it after seeing something like that... yah....

[Aeonknight]

rambus, on 01 April 2010 - 10:49 AM, said:

that's a first, something more effecitve in pvp then out on the field.

but ya has a bit of delay i guess it is runnable from, range is not big, i need to ask though did they stay in a "cone: formation or did it actually aoe?



cant use both, lest you cant in besieged.

it is really hard to someone to sleep/stun/ gravity/ bind a smn and one shoting it after seeing something like that... yah....

Apparently you completely neglected the first thing i posted.

Figure it out. No one said the SMN had to stay there after the 1 shot and let their face get smashed in. They probably have had the idea that staying on the front lines is a bad idea. Or at the very least when 4 people drop that your team then moves in to scatter them, since they're probably now at a disadvantage manpower wise.

[Tekni]

for fucks sake, check your mail and messages rambus.

[Cream Soda]

Not sure about the AoE, was too busy gettin the fk out

[rambus]

Tekni, on 01 April 2010 - 02:36 PM, said:

for fucks sake, check your mail and messages rambus.

i dont get the new layout ;; i click on messages when they pop up><, am i full or something?

Aeonknight, on 01 April 2010 - 02:07 PM, said:

Apparently you completely neglected the first thing i posted.

Figure it out. No one said the SMN had to stay there after the 1 shot and let their face get smashed in. They probably have had the idea that staying on the front lines is a bad idea. Or at the very least when 4 people drop that your team then moves in to scatter them, since they're probably now at a disadvantage manpower wise.

k lets give the smn best case and assume other team dont have sch or rdm or blm or any melee on lookout hiding

This post has been edited by rambus: 01 April 2010 - 09:12 PM

[Tekni]

rambus, on 01 April 2010 - 08:12 PM, said:

i dont get the new layout ;; i click on messages when they pop up><, am i full or something?


k lets give the smn best case and assume other team dont have sch or rdm or blm or any melee on lookout hiding

I was actually talking about your in game messages. you have like 16 mails and 15 messages lol. but with the new KI interface, messages pop up when you open KI

[rambus]

Tekni, on 02 April 2010 - 05:09 PM, said:

I was actually talking about your in game messages. you have like 16 mails and 15 messages lol. but with the new KI interface, messages pop up when you open KI

oh my fl is full so i leave them

the mails are jsut SE saying oh tanks for your feedback, or confirm you canceled this or reactivate that.

This post has been edited by rambus: 02 April 2010 - 10:37 PM

[Prothescar]

PENETRATE!

[Sorai]

Well before update pup was REALLY bad without the pet, and now they probably can deal out damage better on their own, but since
ballistas dead on my server there's really no way to test it out in a real ballista situation.
As for summoner, it never truly "sucked" in ballista. A skilled summoner can easilly nightmare, and from there nether blast people for GB....But I was curious
if Odin makes summoner funner to play in ballista where one can MP Boost, reach over 2k-3k mp, use odin, revitalizer, then re-use odin again, etc etc...

[Omgwtftaru]

From the uncapped matches I've been to recently, most PUPs use the valoredge frame since it can last a while. Also, I don't recall any summoners using nightmare...I think that's pretty much 30 cap only? The times I've been to matches as summoner before the update I just use the merit blood pacts which can easily deal 800+ damage often at times KOing an unbuffed tarutaru mage. The thing about Odin is that it takes about 5 seconds to actually use Zantetsuken and usually gives a window of time for people to run out of range. It is without a doubt incredible to KO a few people grouped together, but if there are more than 3, it usually misses some. I actually have yet to see Alexander in ballista...

This post has been edited by Omgwtftaru: 07 April 2010 - 02:30 AM