[pathwriter]

Ok, so you're just retarded and argumentative. Nothing new there.

[Banter]

The point I was making is that RNG should be able to cast Utsusemi or hit a TE macro as well as any melee DD. If a mob is sitting there swinging away at you, it's not like you're going to be a fucking idiot and keep shooting.

[pathwriter]

And your point is worthless, considering you were the one suggesting just a little while ago that a tank shouldn't be losing aggro. Ranger is penalized more than any other job (except Black Mage, which it most closely resembles) when subjected to mob attacks. Can I get Utsusemi or Third Eye up in relatively quick order after firing off a weaponskill? Sure. But unlike a Monk or Samurai, my DPS is now finished until someone drags the damned thing off me because even one arrow shot is, barring a Rapid Shot proc, likely to take long enough to strip Utsusemi: Ni and leave me naked in the breeze. That's not even accounting for the damage loss for being halfway up some dragon's nostrils instead of standing well back.

As usual, you're basically just arguing for the sake of argument. You don't seem to have a coherent point because practically anything that gets said to you, you attempt to refute. Anyone reading this thread from start to finish would wonder what kind of medication you're on or should be on because consistency is not your strong point.

[Taint]

Our PLDs took a very bad breath to the face last night on Eve and I successfully 3rd eye kited him for 5+ min while they were weakened. So on a kitable mob RNG has a chance. Otherwise RNG is quite worthless with hate.

[Banter]

pathwriter, on 24 August 2010 - 03:48 PM, said:

And your point is worthless, considering you were the one suggesting just a little while ago that a tank shouldn't be losing aggro. Ranger is penalized more than any other job (except Black Mage, which it most closely resembles) when subjected to mob attacks. Can I get Utsusemi or Third Eye up in relatively quick order after firing off a weaponskill? Sure. But unlike a Monk or Samurai, my DPS is now finished until someone drags the damned thing off me because even one arrow shot is, barring a Rapid Shot proc, likely to take long enough to strip Utsusemi: Ni and leave me naked in the breeze. That's not even accounting for the damage loss for being halfway up some dragon's nostrils instead of standing well back.

As usual, you're basically just arguing for the sake of argument. You don't seem to have a coherent point because practically anything that gets said to you, you attempt to refute. Anyone reading this thread from start to finish would wonder what kind of medication you're on or should be on because consistency is not your strong point.

You keep saying shit like I've said RNG is a tank, which I haven't.

[pathwriter]

No, but you have simultaneously insinuated that a Ranger should never take aggro and that they're just as capable as melee jobs when faced with aggro. Neither are remotely true, but you can continue dancing around in hopes that someone will be dazzled enough to ignore your nonsense and think you're making a point.

[Banter]

pathwriter, on 24 August 2010 - 05:20 PM, said:

No, but you have simultaneously insinuated that a Ranger should never take aggro and that they're just as capable as melee jobs when faced with aggro. Neither are remotely true, but you can continue dancing around in hopes that someone will be dazzled enough to ignore your nonsense and think you're making a point.

The two points aren't mutually exclusive. If you have good tanks, you shouldn't be pulling hate. However, if your tanks suck, you'll be pulling hate. Also, I don't see how they're worse off than a WAR when they have something swinging at them. If you're dumb enough to sit there firing arrows while you're about to get pummeled, you deserve it anyways.

[pathwriter]

Either you don't know what mutually exclusive means or you have no clue what you're saying. I'm leaning towards both.

[Banter]

I meant that both points are true, but keep on.

[Spider-Dan]

Banter, on 24 August 2010 - 03:14 PM, said:

The point I was making is that RNG should be able to cast Utsusemi or hit a TE macro as well as any melee DD.

And the point that you're missing is that they aren't. Melee DDs can still deal their damage and be ready to recast shadows/3E the moment it goes down. RNG cannot deal their damage (read: shoot) in the same fashion, because they cannot recast shadows/3E during a shot.

[Banter]

Spider-Dan, on 25 August 2010 - 09:58 AM, said:

And the point that you're missing is that they aren't. Melee DDs can still deal their damage and be ready to recast shadows/3E the moment it goes down. RNG cannot deal their damage (read: shoot) in the same fashion, because they cannot recast shadows/3E during a shot.

And why would someone be retarded enough to keep shooting while a mob is taking swings at them?

[Spider-Dan]

So you're saying that every other DD immediately turns around/disengages anytime they take hate? Or even when they don't have hate, but an AoE wipes their shadows?

[Banter]

Spider-Dan, on 25 August 2010 - 05:36 PM, said:

So you're saying that every other DD immediately turns around/disengages anytime they take hate? Or even when they don't have hate, but an AoE wipes their shadows?

Stop drawing invisible lines.

[fyreus]

I think Dartalion hit the nail on the head. Almost done with dex and DA sword and starting double damage once I get home.

[Hoshiku]

We've been discussing it more in my ls, it will be very interesting to see how often the double damage gun procs... sure is a lot of extra work to upgrade if it deals less total dmg than the oa2 gun (which it looks like it would if it procs less than 26% of the time).

[Dartalion]

fyreus, on 26 August 2010 - 04:58 AM, said:

I think Dartalion hit the nail on the head. Almost done with dex and DA sword and starting double damage once I get home.

its why i went with the bow with +6 str +16 ranged attack

for the gun Well the +6 str +16 ranged attack gun needs 250 opo-opo's fireday/weather (god what a bitch of a trial)

vs the agi+6 ranged acc +16 gun which is much easier to do. (base dmg is still better than anything you can get for gun, and its hella fun for kclub rng)

Granted its not known 100% for sure, but i'm figuring these will both have further magian trials for more upgrades, and best thing is. NO ONE CAN LOT THEM FOR A JOB THEY DON'T USE.

my problem with the oa2/oa3 weapons, yes they are absolutely fantastic in raw damage (comparable with relics) but lacking the low enmity of relic ws is what made me shy away from them. In anything I use rng on hate is always an issue (its why i went to such extremes for my -enmity tp set), my ls doesn't want me being a dumbfuck who pulls hate and mpk's my entire party or worse just so i can scream about my parse!

all that being said, go with your playstyle, those are just my ramblings and i'm not arrogant enough to say that "my way is the right way" its just a different way of doing things and its effective.

As for the double dmg weapons, I haven't seen any quantified data so I'll withhold speculation.

This post has been edited by Dartalion: 28 August 2010 - 07:41 PM

[Darcatvar]

pathwriter, on 08 August 2010 - 12:24 PM, said:

Double Shot and Occasionally Attacks Twice interact exactly as Double Attack and OAT do. You'll still get a gain from Double Shot, but it'll be interfered with by the bow on occasion. Considering Double Shot has a maximum uptime of 50%, this isn't really a terrible thing.

I wish people would stop saying this, the OAT on the range weapons does stack with Double Shot. Fortunately SE was kind to ranger, or cruel depending on your view. I have the finished OAT Condor and with it I have parsed close to 60% double shots, 58% was the highest I parsed one VNM fight.

[pathwriter]

That is what I said, you insipid jackass. Learn how to read.

[Darcatvar]

pathwriter, on 06 September 2010 - 12:19 AM, said:

That is what I said, you insipid jackass. Learn how to read.

No need to name call, just degrades your point. You said is acts just as double attack, it does not, double attack does not stack with OAT weapons. You said double shot would "interfere" with the OAT and it does not, it striaght stacks.

[pathwriter]

Wrong on both counts.