[Nameless]

Kirschy, on 31 January 2011 - 06:58 AM, said:

To consider it another way, let's start off with the assumption that a 5-hit 528 delay is easy to get from gear alone. Going from a 5-hit build to a 4-hit build is about ~25% increase in WS frequency. (If you would have WS'd 100 times, you'd WS 125 times instead, increasing your WS DMG by 25%.) Using Atma of Griffon claw alone is 20% increase in WS frequency. (Includes 10 Scythe skill for acc/attack too.) Then you have an entire atma left to make up the 5% WS damage, 10% crit rate, and 10% DA, which I think would be easily outdone with Atma of Apoc. This also assumes a direct 25% increase in WS Frequency, when you'll over-tp a bunch with OAT, so the number is probably lower. I just feel you sacrifice too much to get the 4-hit build working, and that other atma would give you higher damage output.

That's why I felt that I have to ask if RR is even necessary. I have no doubt Apoc will top 5% WS damage, 10% crit rate, and 10% DA, but will RR top that when the majority of my damage is coming from WS? I was thinking about Apoc/SQ/PB instead of RR/SQ/PB.

But I agree with you, 4 hit is probably slightly overkill. Tho you probably did pick the best atma possible for the debate. Other than the standard RR/GC/Apoc, I am not sure if any other atma is even good enough to compete. A/O probably is close too. Tho stacking any TA is likely not going to be the best for OAT consider every time you TA, you sort of wasted the OAT that could potentially proc, thus making it 40% of the time the TA proc it is just a 1 hit gain instead of a 2 hit. Stuff like that makes it extremely hard to put together a perfect combo for this weapon.

As for verthandis eye, my LS did this a long time ago as lvl 75. It wasn't hard but I don't have any experience lowmaning it. I got 8 eyes in one raid from 4 verthandis and then 2 soon after, so I don't have a very good recollection of what was the setup. I know two plds, a couple blus, few melees, and 2-3 support jobs was the setup for us. But I doublt you will need more than 6 ppl for that now at lvl 90. It does have some pretty annoying moves but nothing you can't get out of range for.

[Nameless]

Blah, I just realized that going from 5 hit to 4 hit is actually a 33% increase in WS frequency since you WS every 3 regular hits instead of 4. That probably changed things a little bit.

[Banter]

Kirschy, on 31 January 2011 - 06:58 AM, said:

To consider it another way, let's start off with the assumption that a 5-hit 528 delay is easy to get from gear alone. Going from a 5-hit build to a 4-hit build is about ~25% increase in WS frequency. (If you would have WS'd 100 times, you'd WS 125 times instead, increasing your WS DMG by 25%.) Using Atma of Griffon claw alone is 20% increase in WS frequency. (Includes 10 Scythe skill for acc/attack too.) Then you have an entire atma left to make up the 5% WS damage, 10% crit rate, and 10% DA, which I think would be easily outdone with Atma of Apoc. This also assumes a direct 25% increase in WS Frequency, when you'll over-tp a bunch with OAT, so the number is probably lower. I just feel you sacrifice too much to get the 4-hit build working, and that other atma would give you higher damage output.

10% DA would only be 6% with 40% proc rate on OAT Scythe (unless they stack nicely unlike old OA+ weapons), further reducing effectiveness.

[Nameless]

Over tp will likely be a common problem regardless of the hit build for OAT weapon, so that wouldn't reduce effectiveness.

And yes, 10% DA will be 6% since they don't stack. But the same can be said about TA from apoc, as I mentioned, tho not nearly as bad in term of reduced effect.

[Banter]

Nameless, on 31 January 2011 - 09:32 AM, said:

Over tp will likely be a common problem regardless of the hit build for OAT weapon

Going to echo this. You're going to over kill TP the same with either build because you have the same chance to get to 100 from one and two hits away with both builds.

[Taint]

Over TP is not that big of a deal an extra round is an extra round. If you swing once or 3 times that same round was required and the extra hits just add to DoT.