[UNCTGTG]

Everyone should lay off Chris, he is entitled to his own opinion. Hell remember when we always hated madawc (where is he btw), and then he made some useful posts.

[Chriscoffey]

UNCTGTG, on 21 December 2010 - 11:33 PM, said:

Everyone should lay off Chris, he is entitled to his own opinion. Hell remember when we always hated madawc (where is he btw), and then he made some useful posts.

I have made some useful post the problem is no one can argue anything of game dynamics like calculations and such. They can only challenge me by insults and rhetoric. If you want to prove something in Quantum mechanics you need the math to do it. If you want me to be proven wrong the same principles apply. My personal opinion or anyone else for that matter means nothing unless you can back it with data not opinions. I make my cases for what i say based upon their perspective times and place compared to what is available. I really can't see how Banter or Pathwriter are even commenting on a Dark forum about Apocalypse to tell me to shut up. I actually have the weapon completed to stage 4 and i had the stage 5 (you know back when LR+DB+haste belt+ march x 2 regular+haste spell = 93.3% haste every LR use w/o 2 hours) in reach at one time in my dark career. I have every valid reason to weigh in my own opinion to what the game does or changes compared to my years of playing in these forums. I am busy trying to buy a house and working currently hence why I'm taking a break.

Kirschy I wasn't in a great LS at that time but I was really just getting started watching the more top tiered LS's. In retrospect they were noob compared to the other servers but not like today's standards for the average player are. I will try some of those HNM you mentioned but the fact still remains there is an invincible button you can push (P.brew) that allows you to, without people, kill anything it seems. This new update allowed the players to use only 200k for a primeval brew in cuor (according to wiki). The fact is any of those HNM you mentioned will be a cake walk now. You and me both know noone will be trying those HNM for a challenge considering they have installed the easy button for everyone. I guess that is what im leaning too with my challenge argument. You could very well go to tiamat now naked and possibly make it a challenge if a person wanted but if you put your armor on and with few people its a joke not even worthy of being an experience mob.

EDIT: I have also been told by a reliable source the major relic boost's are coming next update so be prepared. They are suppose to start making them very powerful and adjust accordingly considering the potency of the new emp. weapons. They know the relics are fairly weak compared to the work in gaining them vs emp weapons.

This post has been edited by Chriscoffey: 22 December 2010 - 12:39 AM

[Arkanethered]

And this update is when? June?... I'm waiting for a new time frame to be announced for completion to 99.

[UNCTGTG]

Arkanethered, on 22 December 2010 - 03:28 AM, said:

And this update is when? June?... I'm waiting for a new time frame to be announced for completion to 99.

March - level cap 95
June - Levle cap 99
Sept - Merits teir 3
Dec - omg we are shutting down servers (we have no content left) jking

[Kirschy]

Chriscoffey, on 22 December 2010 - 12:22 AM, said:

Kirschy I wasn't in a great LS at that time but I was really just getting started watching the more top tiered LS's. In retrospect they were noob compared to the other servers but not like today's standards for the average player are. I will try some of those HNM you mentioned but the fact still remains there is an invincible button you can push (P.brew) that allows you to, without people, kill anything it seems. This new update allowed the players to use only 200k for a primeval brew in cuor (according to wiki). The fact is any of those HNM you mentioned will be a cake walk now. You and me both know noone will be trying those HNM for a challenge considering they have installed the easy button for everyone. I guess that is what im leaning too with my challenge argument. You could very well go to tiamat now naked and possibly make it a challenge if a person wanted but if you put your armor on and with few people its a joke not even worthy of being an experience mob.

EDIT: I have also been told by a reliable source the major relic boost's are coming next update so be prepared. They are suppose to start making them very powerful and adjust accordingly considering the potency of the new emp. weapons. They know the relics are fairly weak compared to the work in gaining them vs emp weapons.

You'll have no arguments to me when it comes to brew. Any fight is pretti much soloable with brew and it does remove the challenge from the fight, and allows most people to obtain harder gear they wouldn't normalli be able to obtain. That all said, my LS is still doing Abyssea regularly unlocking the Tier T3 NMs and trying them out, developing strategies and farming the new equipment and atma. While the word 'challenge' is definitely up for interpretation, I strongly feel the level of play/skill needed to win some of the harder T3 mobs is equivalent to the skill needed to kill the HNMs added years back in CoP/ToA/WoTG. I admit I'm lucky to have always been apart of a component LS that was able to put any new event on farming status, but I feel thats why I'm in a good position to make my argument. The other aspect of these fights to consider is that they all seem to drop the item needed for Lv90 Empyrean Trials. And they don't drop at the wonderful rate of Buds, Laterns, or Skins. (You can farm the NM 3 times proccing all !!, and only see 1 item drop. And you need 75 of them.) This means that player trying to upgrade to their Lv90 Emp weapons is going to need to farm the hell out of that NM. Brew farming these NMs is just not very feasible for most.

I feel the current balance between Empyrean and Relics is ok atm. While I wouldn't mind having Relics on top again, I'm not expecting it at all. TBH I'm not sure I even expect a level cap increase next update. I think we'll go back to the old updates of adding content to olds zones, new mats/synth/synergy, a few job adjustments, and a plethora of new Weapon/Armor trials. I think when they're ready for the next level cap increase it'll be 90-99 in one shot, and hopefully will add a ton of new content to go with it~

Also to UNCTGTG and to Chris, I hope my replies/argument aren't being taken the wrong way. I might sound a little harsh at times, but I'm not one to take things too seriously. I enjoy good discussions and I like to have a good argument or two in the process!

[UNCTGTG]

Kirschy, on 22 December 2010 - 08:53 AM, said:

You'll have no arguments to me when it comes to brew. Any fight is pretti much soloable with brew and it does remove the challenge from the fight, and allows most people to obtain harder gear they wouldn't normalli be able to obtain. That all said, my LS is still doing Abyssea regularly unlocking the Tier T3 NMs and trying them out, developing strategies and farming the new equipment and atma. While the word 'challenge' is definitely up for interpretation, I strongly feel the level of play/skill needed to win some of the harder T3 mobs is equivalent to the skill needed to kill the HNMs added years back in CoP/ToA/WoTG. I admit I'm lucky to have always been apart of a component LS that was able to put any new event on farming status, but I feel thats why I'm in a good position to make my argument. The other aspect of these fights to consider is that they all seem to drop the item needed for Lv90 Empyrean Trials. And they don't drop at the wonderful rate of Buds, Laterns, or Skins. (You can farm the NM 3 times proccing all !!, and only see 1 item drop. And you need 75 of them.) This means that player trying to upgrade to their Lv90 Emp weapons is going to need to farm the hell out of that NM. Brew farming these NMs is just not very feasible for most.

I feel the current balance between Empyrean and Relics is ok atm. While I wouldn't mind having Relics on top again, I'm not expecting it at all. TBH I'm not sure I even expect a level cap increase next update. I think we'll go back to the old updates of adding content to olds zones, new mats/synth/synergy, a few job adjustments, and a plethora of new Weapon/Armor trials. I think when they're ready for the next level cap increase it'll be 90-99 in one shot, and hopefully will add a ton of new content to go with it~

Also to UNCTGTG and to Chris, I hope my replies/argument aren't being taken the wrong way. I might sound a little harsh at times, but I'm not one to take things too seriously. I enjoy good discussions and I like to have a good argument or two in the process!

None taken, I actually enjoy our conversations on the boards. I still hold out hope for relics because it has taken us so much to do. My Set takes down anything inside abyessa. We just killed our 7th boss and working towards our 9th. We only meet 2 days a week for 3 hrs a night but yet we are getting everything that everyone wants. And what is nice, we have been friends and together for nearly 3 years now, through salvage, limbus, assaults, etc.

[Chriscoffey]

Nah Kirschy. I like the fact of how you test out the new content to reply with feasible information to digest. You are pretty much the type of player i like to associate with in game. They mentioned very many times relics would always be the top weapon and considering I'm a bit bias to this fact( since doing apoc my 2nd time) i really hope that is still the case of the future plans.

Kirschy i have been in better LS's not just on carbuncle. I left carbuncle and joined Peseverence on Quetzacoatl and met some people there. I was doing apocalypse at the time and was 15 jades from apocalypse back when Apocalypse had no limits. I then lost the character to someone i trusted so i took a break then started over with some friends on Seraph. I joined Kanzen and was talking to Rukenshin about what he knew and also met Nagamaki. I learned alot from them and Beyond the Limitation. Things got stale so i took another break when all this bot war shit was going on. I then moved to Ifrit to join ClaimTrain which was a dominant LS there. I am currently back on Carbuncle but my friends all quit and my cousin is using my character for whatever reason. I just find the biggest part of my playing was being with my friends i met and most have quit due to the ease of playing.

For all my times and servers i have been on i have yet to find a LS that has people like you kirschy for every member. You typically have a few top tier people who know their game knowledge then the rest knowing very little. I can't even begin to tell you how shitty most drks or blms are just in stunning. Most people can't even stun something to pay attention without a damn bot to do it. I was practicing stunning on imps doing amnesia. It is quite easy to do that stun in asia where pings are lower but in the eastern side of the US ping is very latent and makes one be on their game. That is just one example of things i did to improve myself. Unless someone was packet botting or had a super low ping they would not out stun me. Stunning itself is easy but the paying attention to do it would be the tricky part.

That is the focus aspect of FFXI and YES in words it sounds easy but most couldn't do just that simple thing. I know several people who had to set up bots because they couldn't focus to do it. It's those same people who have spellcast jacked up with every single thing they can and still they say it's not cheating. I can't see how you can honestly have everything being done for you and still think you are good because of a bot doing it for you. I understand the upped DPS but the fact still remains that you are having it auto done for you when someone else doing it on their own has to properly time everything manually. I set up just one XML for spellcast for BLM and it was so much fail that i felt i was cheating myself in playing to do that. I have yet to use spellcast again. I still use windower but the macro addtions for 2-3 extra slots is the maximum of its use. I know it's a part of cheating but I was tired of using 3 macros for a sorcerer's ring when everyone would spam heal me.

This post has been edited by Chriscoffey: 22 December 2010 - 01:30 PM

[UNCTGTG]

Chriscoffey, on 22 December 2010 - 12:47 PM, said:

Nah Kirschy. I like the fact of how you test out the new content to reply with feasible information to digest. You are pretty much the type of player i like to associate with in game. They mentioned very many times relics would always be the top weapon and considering I'm a bit bias to this fact( since doing apoc my 2nd time) i really hope that is still the case of the future plans.

Let us relic users infuse all our atmas full time into the relics. lol I have 44 of them, actually 45 now.

This post has been edited by UNCTGTG: 22 December 2010 - 01:11 PM

[Arkanethered]

I personally would have enjoyed each relic having its own synthetic atma from our memory of the quest...


Or relics having the ability to buy a 4th lunar and it only be active while the relic is equiped.

But these are just addressing the balance issues within abyssea.

[Banter]

Arkanethered, on 22 December 2010 - 02:57 PM, said:

I personally would have enjoyed each relic having its own synthetic atma from our memory of the quest...


Or relics having the ability to buy a 4th lunar and it only be active while the relic is equiped.

But these are just addressing the balance issues within abyssea.

Specific atma would be pretty cool tbh, but you guys would probably get haste again lol.

[Goshtin]

stop being so nice to each other
we're DRKS for gods sakE!
more rage and grumpy assholeyness!

[marionette]

Chriscoffey, on 22 December 2010 - 12:47 PM, said:

For all my times and servers i have been on i have yet to find a LS that has people like you kirschy for every member.

i think that's impossible, and they'd all be blue haired tarus at that

[Banter]

marionette, on 22 December 2010 - 05:53 PM, said:

i think that's impossible, and they'd all be blue haired tarus at that

It's not impossible, it just requires a lot of server transfers.

[Kirschy]

I agree with you on most your points, Chris. But I'll admit my LS is not top tier at all! As you predicted we've got a few great people at the core, and the rest are a bunch of cool peoples looking for some fun. (Marionette is a sack and one of the core founding members of the LS I'm in! But he won't let me invite any random blue hair tarus to the LS =x)

Back on topic a bit, a player on BG upgraded his Empyrean to Lv90 and noticed no WS DMG boost or AM duration changes. Seems like only Mythic/Relics got the boost. This is a good sign that Lv90 Relics will be much more competitive than before! I always kinda suspected they would add Job Specific Synthetic Atmas to Abyssea to balance out some jobs in Abyssea, but it doesn't seem like that'll happen anymore. As much as I'd love relic atmas, I think just one nice relic atma that only applies to relics would be nice. Something along the lines of making relic WS crit in Abyssea at the cost of using an Atma. But I've accepted the way things are atm, I am just hoping for some nice future content outside Abyssea!

Also just to bring up this point which I've been musing about:

Is Hex still around and willing to do more tests on Quietus? (or anyone else for that matter.) The testing I found was mostly inconclusive and didn't test a few crucial aspects of the WS. I'm curious how Lv90 Apoc would stack up to Lv90 Redemption given the new WS Boost on relics~

[Arkanethered]

I just obtained a shadow belt... What would be the appropriate way of testing this thing?

[Chriscoffey]

Arkanethered, on 23 December 2010 - 12:17 PM, said:

I just obtained a shadow belt... What would be the appropriate way of testing this thing?

Find a game programmer that works for SE and ask him for his code.

[Kirschy]

Arkanethered, on 23 December 2010 - 12:17 PM, said:

I just obtained a shadow belt... What would be the appropriate way of testing this thing?

I have one myself, and plan on confirming the +.15 to ftp when I get the chance. You'd realli need to use a consistent damage WS like Leaden Salute or something. Unfortunately aside from Leaden, the other consistent damage WS like Cataclysm and Infernal Scythe don't have correct damage calculations. So it's a two-part test if you don't have a COR =p.

[Arkanethered]

I don't have Cor, but the +.15 ftp if you confirm it is better than anything we have access to?

[Kirschy]

Arkanethered, on 23 December 2010 - 01:41 PM, said:

I don't have Cor, but the +.15 ftp if you confirm it is better than anything we have access to?

Bale Belt(Best WS belt I believe?): The most it will add is 2 to WSC. Which ends up being less than 1% increase in most situations.
Shadow Belt: 3.0ftp/2.85ftp = 5.3% Upgrade

So yea, Shadow Belt is always going to be better~

[Taint]

Kirschy, on 23 December 2010 - 02:13 PM, said:

Bale Belt(Best WS belt I believe?): The most it will add is 2 to WSC. Which ends up being less than 1% increase in most situations.
Shadow Belt: 3.0ftp/2.85ftp = 5.3% Upgrade

So yea, Shadow Belt is always going to be better~

Bale belt was one of my fav abyssea drops too! I guess its still good for guillotine.