[Zentaku]

So I've been thinking pretty intensively about coming back to FFXI for my favorite job of all time DRK. However I know theres been a s**ton of updates since last time I played (back when the cap was 75). So much so that some jobs don't even do what they used to anymore (Ninja's nukin' now? the hell is this?). SO I'm just wondering on an average scale how are Drks in terms of dmg?

Last I played Sam was clearly the golden child and if you wanted to compete you had to be top notch in what you were doing. From what I hear Mnk is the new top dog now.

So just looking for a mini i guess "tier" list if you will in terms of the best in dds.

[UNCTGTG]

Only update we have gotten is a 180 second duration of Last Resort. Sam/mnk/nin are kings of DDs now.

[Arkley]

You know, I glance over these forums from time to time, and I keep seeing you lump SAM in with MNK & NIN - usually while bitching that DRK isn't as good as them. And you seem to be serious about it, too. Are you fucking high, or just incredibly stupid? SAM is in the same boat as DRK, if not even worse off. Their damage output is pathetic in Abyssea, and they suffer even worse issues than DRK when it comes to damage mitigation.

Seriously, if you're going to bitch and whine about how your job isn't up to scratch any more (which I agree, it isn't), at least compare it to the right fucking jobs while crying about it.

[Chriscoffey]

Arkley, on 16 May 2011 - 10:20 AM, said:

You know, I glance over these forums from time to time, and I keep seeing you lump SAM in with MNK & NIN - usually while bitching that DRK isn't as good as them. And you seem to be serious about it, too. Are you fucking high, or just incredibly stupid? SAM is in the same boat as DRK, if not even worse off. Their damage output is pathetic in Abyssea, and they suffer even worse issues than DRK when it comes to damage mitigation.

Seriously, if you're going to bitch and whine about how your job isn't up to scratch any more (which I agree, it isn't), at least compare it to the right fucking jobs while crying about it.

Samurai's were running off and leaving most Dark Knights before Abyssea was even around. The only way a Dark could even get ahead as a damage DD against an "AH" Sam was to have the best of the best gear selection from rare/ex gear sets. I am sick and tired of people saying they recollect the fucking past when it's very apparent they don't have a clue on the matter. Taint is sporting around using your so called Samurai with Fudo as we speak and he's pulling down numbers that make dark knights envious YET you claim Sam is lower than Dark Knight. Get your god damn facts straight before you start stating facts of which evidently are false.

This post has been edited by Chriscoffey: 16 May 2011 - 06:20 PM

[Derock]

SAM isn't even close to MNK, NIN or WAR - the last of which you keep forgetting all the time. Soon as we're outside of Abyssea on a more consistent basis, DRK is going to be broken due to 3 minutes desperate blows.

[Zentaku]

All I really wanna know is if I can go back to being happy with a GSD. Really all I loved about Drk. Scythe is cool and all but I loved GSD so as long as I can do some decent dmg with gsd and be able to get further along Im cool with whatever. I had Drk/Sam/Mnk/Thf lvl'd before but this time around I'd probably just go with Drk and maybe a mage job like sch (provided it has any use now).

I don't care about beating the over powered War or nin nuking or mnks...whatever it is mnks do now. Just being able to actually be helpful while having fun is good enough for me.

Granted however if I'm just a wasted slot thats gonna suck. Being the bottom surely doesn't make ya feel good but I guess someones gotta be there. So to my understanding the ranking would be something similar to:

War > Nin > Mnk > Pup > Sam > Drg >Thf > Blu > Drk?

Based off of a few questions I've asked a couple friends from their experiences anyway.

This post has been edited by Zentaku: 16 May 2011 - 10:11 PM

[treelo]

You'd be at the bottom anyway.

[Zentaku]

HAH HAH! F*ckin' Treelo! That's the kinda shit I wanna see! How ya been man? God I hate you!

[Derock]

Zentaku, on 16 May 2011 - 10:02 PM, said:

All I really wanna know is if I can go back to being happy with a GSD. Really all I loved about Drk. Scythe is cool and all but I loved GSD so as long as I can do some decent dmg with gsd and be able to get further along Im cool with whatever. I had Drk/Sam/Mnk/Thf lvl'd before but this time around I'd probably just go with Drk and maybe a mage job like sch (provided it has any use now).

I don't care about beating the over powered War or nin nuking or mnks...whatever it is mnks do now. Just being able to actually be helpful while having fun is good enough for me.

Granted however if I'm just a wasted slot thats gonna suck. Being the bottom surely doesn't make ya feel good but I guess someones gotta be there. So to my understanding the ranking would be something similar to:

War > Nin > Mnk > Pup > Sam > Drg >Thf > Blu > Drk?

Based off of a few questions I've asked a couple friends from their experiences anyway.

Fairly off

MNK = NIN > WAR > DRG = THF (maybe) > Other DDs (including RNG, lol) > SAM > DRK

It's almost entirely due to the last two jobs lacking a crit WS. However, all of these are assuming appropriate Empyrean or Nyzul WS's (smite, drakes etc). Without them, WAR, THF and NIN all come out ahead of them by a fair margin.

[Zentaku]

Oh yea Rng (I forgot Blm too). Alright guess that works

[Taint]

Derock, on 16 May 2011 - 07:55 PM, said:

SAM isn't even close to MNK, NIN or WAR - the last of which you keep forgetting all the time. Soon as we're outside of Abyssea on a more consistent basis, DRK is going to be broken due to 3 minutes desperate blows.

My Fudo SAM completely rapes my Apoc DRK inside and outside abyssea. Its really a shame too. EmpGS would make it closer but still isn't touching EmpGKT. Outside assuming highend gear empSAM will compete for the top. If the haste cap was 85 or 90 DRK would be a badass DD but 80 is too restricting.


Edit: Should have mentioned Outside Non-E/R/M SAMs would still fair better then Non-E/R/M DRKs but not by much and neither are touching a WAR.

This post has been edited by Taint: 17 May 2011 - 08:18 AM

[pathwriter]

Your Samurai has an Empyrean weapon with a ~40% Double Damage proc aftermath on its associated (relatively high damage) weaponskill.

Your Dark Knight has a Relic weapon with a 10% gear Haste proc aftermath on its associated (and mediocre damage) weaponskill.

You are not comparing two similar situations and, as such, have a very skewed (wrong) idea about how Samurai is performing.

[Taint]

Woot Path is back!

Im comparing them doing the exact same event and mobs. Its no contest outside, which is where I've spent the last week. Add an Emp and a DRK still isn't keeping up.

With your logic we shouldn't compare any jobs since they all represent different situations.

This post has been edited by Taint: 17 May 2011 - 04:13 PM

[pathwriter]

Taint, on 17 May 2011 - 03:51 PM, said:

Add an Emp and a DRK still isn't keeping up.

What Dark Knight is this? It clearly isn't you.

Ultimately, though, I actually don't care a whit about Samurai and Dark Knight having a pissing contest to see who is the most worthless melee DPS in the game. The fact that you (and others) keep forgetting about Warrior while whinging about Monk and Ninja is rather amusing. But, either way, you're comparing two grossly dissimilar weapons and pretending that this doesn't account for the difference. If a Dark Knight with Caladbolg or Redemption is still worse than a Samurai with Tachi: Fudo... does it really matter when you're being beaten out by Puppetmaster and Thief?

[pathwriter]

Oh, also, I've been meaning to ask this since I started playing again: why the hell are you so obsessed with doing the most damage? I mean, no, I do understand the whole "My self-worth is determined by what my video game avatar does," so don't bother saying that. What I mean is that pretty much everything in Abyssea is trivially easy even with mid-range gear and Atmas. Most of the time I'm killing things, we have to keep DPS slow and irritating while we sort out which weaponskill/spell will stagger the NM appropriately. We don't even bother with a heavy buff line like some people are so obsessed about because it is ultimately boring and wasted time for all those Bards and Corsairs and such because their buffs are terrifyingly unnecessary.

[Taint]

The game is back outside again. VW and even the new dynamis NMs are good fun challenges.
Outside the game changes as you know. WAR is still king but the rest of the order gets a good juggle.

Also we dont hold mobs for procs, procs dont effect emp items. Being able to pummel mobs speeds up the process. We still try for grellow but don't slow damage to do so. Most people are close to capped on bluebox gear.

Doing some Arch DLs in an hour, should be fun!

[Derock]

I'm sure MNK will still be a top tier DD like always, but I recon that NIN will drop down a good bit and stuff will be closer to pre-abyssea days as far as DD pecking order goes.

[Taint]

MNK is sill solid, WAR stays on top though. 2handers regain their advantage without atma. Some of the new mobs have crazy eva and def.

[Derock]

Taint, on 18 May 2011 - 07:20 AM, said:

MNK is sill solid, WAR stays on top though. 2handers regain their advantage without atma. Some of the new mobs have crazy eva and def.

So pretty much what I said. Bandwagoner's are going to jump back on WAR, SAM or some other 2hander and people who know what they're doing are going to keep playing MNK.

[Taint]

Derock, on 18 May 2011 - 10:35 AM, said:

So pretty much what I said. Bandwagoner's are going to jump back on WAR, SAM or some other 2hander and people who know what they're doing are going to keep playing MNK.

While I love playing MNK, I don't fully understand your statement.