[Zaris]

Just hit 37 and w00t I've crossed the halfway line! Flash is advancing my Divine magic skill like mad. And it always turns the head of a mob. Tho literally I save it for mob's special hits and stuff. Is that how I should use it? Or simply aggro maker?

Yeah once you Invincible and have your teammates keep nuking and voking it over and over again, you'll eventually get Invincible off. Tried and tested at the Citadel. = /

[Llednari]

Errr.. I had a really rich ninja PT with me one time.. I tanked for a little while but then the nin just kept using utsusemi and provoking so i thought, what the hell.. i'll just let ya tank. so.. i sat there for like 4 hours doing nothing and fell asleep. the end.

[Zaris]

Same here. Just yesterday I partied with a Ninja (or rather the Ninja partied with US ) and was casting Utsusemi:Ni and Utsusemi:Ichi. He would provoke from time to time and was pretty good at maintaining hate. So much that at his second provoke I can cast Flash w/out him losing aggro on his mob. This was in Gustav Tunnel.

Guess we both have different methods at holding enemies. His utsusemi and my cures. Tho literally he couldn't hold it as great because it went for the black or white mage from time to time but nothing too often to complain about. Still now that I"ve witnessed it first hand, it's not a bad thing. Switch tanks depending on whether you're fighting goblins or hornflies.

Plus it raised my polearm skill.

[EstorilPaladinETC]

I didn't have time to read the whole thread, so sorry if I repeat someone.

Its overall not a good idea to have both a Paladin and Ninja in the same group. In situations where there is both a PLD/WAR and NIN/WAR in the group, the best interest of the group is to have the NIN/WAR as main tank. This can be difficult though, because Paladin naturally will get hate even if he doesn't provoke. So if he does provoke even once, then the NIN/WAR will have a hard time getting that aggro back. Ninja's even in groups without Paladins have trouble keeping aggro. They do have it most of the time because of provoke, but the monsters do stray away towards the mages constantly. Paladin on the other hand have the ability to keep the hate on them more consistently than Ninja. The monsters might stray away from Paladin as well, but no where near as much as Ninja.

What it comes down to is that Ninja's blink ability is very nice, and allows them to make an awsome tank. But Paladin is overall a better tank because of their ability to hold hate. Because they do hold hate better than Ninja, putting them together in a group can get messy not go the way the group wishes.

[Sindarius]

You have to keep focus on one tank. PLD does this best, hands down. I am a 58 PLD and when forming pt's I avoid the 2 tank senario cause it does lead to problems. I usually stick to formations like WHM/RDM/BLM/BRD/DRG/PLD or WHM/RDM/BLM/DRK/DRG/PLD. The thing I would say is one of you has to let go of your pride as a tank and be an emergency voke. Honestly PLD is not very good at anything but being a tank, which means nin should be focused on something else, lowering resists for mage and something of the sort. Causing a tank to intentionally lose agro is bad since it effects agro table and in turn can get agro put on mages unintentionally. It's also the reason I stopped PTing with THF's who were SA+TA just to see big damage numbers. Its not that the PLD has a chip on his shoulder, it's called Agro Management. I noticed at higher levels almost nobody goes without a PLD. But, as they say, to each thier own.

[Kosmos]

Coming from a DRK, if you want to "steal" aggro, then make sure you have a DRK on hand ... but even this is risky ... for the whole party.

At level 30+, Last Resort + Soul Eater (I have this macro btw called Death Cometh) will take hate away from PLD bar none 100% regardless of what PLD does. Couple this with Berserk and you have a recipe for the most damage dished out consecutively (not one shot hits like a RNG or THF will do). The first critical will insure PLD will not get hate back for almost a couple of provokes and this is where you, the NIN can come in (Voke and monster will miss due to your blink and of course there's a 50/50 chance he stays with you or go back to DRK no matter what that PLD does). However, this generally means the DRK is ph*cked. Like ... seriously. ^^; On a Tough monster, it's not bad, because the party can take down the monster quickly. On an IT ... pray. And pray like you've never done before.

If the DRK is 60+ (and uh, so is your party, d'oh!), maybe he can trick hate off of PLD and on to you. *shrugs* I can't figure out what level you are now so I can't really help you ... :/

[Flick]

I have to comment on that last post, cuz its not a 100% , i am a 41 PLD, and i ve had a Drk do exactly wat u said, Coupled with a Monk doing 100 Fists and i still kept aggro. It all depends on how well and how efficient the PLD is. Plds dont voke every 30 seconds, lots of times they wait for the mob to move b4 they voke, which is bad, because Vokes stack, and the faster u do them the more hate they pull, also Flash is ver very effective, especially if ur Divine is high. I try to Unleash a flash at the begining, shield bash or Sentinel, and a few Cure 2's, Voke every 30 seconds, and no one is taking that Mob From u^^

[Kimmara]

From what I've read so far, Moka either needs to find himself a new job or stop whining because "the pld won't let me get hit..."

Wake up, learn what you ARE supposed to do as a nin when not tanking. Simple as that.

[paladiny]

the best way to take off hate off pld is be rdm with blm sub !
buy 10 ethers and use chainspell

[Sirch]

Man, WARs always want to be the tanks even when they have lower defence and HP...I just let them kill themselves to the point of having like 100HP left, THEN I take the aggro back.

[Zaris]

You know the craziest thing happened last night. We were attacking flies in Crawlers Nest and we were taking a lot of damage (like 3 cursed spheres!) so the white mage had to heal us all eh? She used Divine Seal and then Curaga 2. It took Invincible, Flash, and a Provoke to turn its head back at me. I couldn't believe that for the first time Invincible failed to do what it was meant to do - make me die first. >.>

[Phlow]

( . So I wanted to switch sides and have our Mandra's sleep them so they'd know what it was like. The other tank in my party... Had other plans. He kept voking it to other side, getting it DANGEROUSLY close to our mages. I asked him what he was doing. No response. I repeated. No response. I even explained what I was doing and asked the rest of the group if it was ok. They said sounded like a good idea, and it might make the others camp farther away from us. But STILL no response. I finally threatened to leave if he 'voked it near our mages one more time. He stopped ^^

[Seraphiel]

Zaris :
You know the craziest thing happened last night. We were attacking flies in Crawlers Nest and we were taking a lot of damage (like 3 cursed spheres!) so the white mage had to heal us all eh? She used Divine Seal and then Curaga 2. It took Invincible, Flash, and a Provoke to turn its head back at me. I couldn't believe that for the first time Invincible failed to do what it was meant to do - make me die first. >.>

Was everyone's HP in yellow/orange zone when the WHM used her Divine Seal + Curaga II?

As far as I know, the more HP you heal, the more hate you will receive. The amount of HP recovered matters more than the name of the spell. For example, if you cast Cure IV to heal 10 hp, it will not produce as much hate as Cure II to heal 100 hp.

Therefore, your WHM probably gained mega tons of hate by healing all of you from yellow/orange to white HP zone.

[Kosmos]

Zaris :
You know the craziest thing happened last night. We were attacking flies in Crawlers Nest and we were taking a lot of damage (like 3 cursed spheres!) so the white mage had to heal us all eh? She used Divine Seal and then Curaga 2. It took Invincible, Flash, and a Provoke to turn its head back at me. I couldn't believe that for the first time Invincible failed to do what it was meant to do - make me die first. >.>

There was a similar situation in which myself (DRK), DRG, MNK and WHM were caught in a bad situation. We had taken down a Lab Scorp and seeing how everything in that area (Maze) was EP anyway, didn't bother to heal. Forgot that undead have this extremely great sense for HP loss >.> To make the story short, we got 3 ghouls and 2 wights trying to muscle in on the action with another Lab Scorp thinking to avenge his fallen bretheren. >< WHM used Divine Seal + Curaga 2 when we took down 3 of the undead and of course that drew so much hate. Took 3 vokes to pull it off ... and I ended up tanking the rest of the way >< Yay for the way a DRK can get more hate than a pally .. mwahaha